Ron DeSantis on what being conservative means: 'Our rights come from God, not government'

Not to mention that should put to bed forever the right of a woman to make her own health care decisions... Can't wait for Florida to be rescinding all abortion bans...

 

Allow me to remind you of what the topic of the thread is.

Ron DeSantis on what being conservative means: 'Our rights come from God, not government'

The writers of the Constitution were greatly influenced by the Judeo/Christian religion (even if some of them were deists). That religion has its roots grounded in the Bible and because of that the Bible is definitely on topic in this thread. Much of the thinking behind the Bill of Rights found in the Constitution (which actually is what the topic is about) can be traced back to the history of the settlers to the colonies. They weren't atheists. As such, their thinking and way of life revolved around religious beliefs. Even the reasons for coming to America (for many) was due to religion. You can't simply dismiss the influence religion had on the foundations of our country unless you revise history.

 

Men have a way of changing their minds. Not exactly a foundation I'm betting my rights on.

 

Is it not odd that before the Constitution, there God given or natural rights were never adopted anywhere else?

Indeed it does, but it does not make that premise a valid one.

You couldn't if you tried.

Again, learning about them does not make everything about them valid.

I used it to illustrate the failed premise you used and it clearly went over your head.

 

AKA Dominionism.

 

What does "unenforced rights" mean? Does it mean if I have the right to live someone is forcing me to live?

 

A bit ironic don't you think?

DeSantis saying that our rights come from God, not the government. The Founders rejected the Divine Right of Kings.

Divine Right is the idea that the Kings Power and Authority comes from God.

So, in essence what DeSantis is saying is that our rights don't come from God...they come from God.

Just more evidence that what our Founding Fathers were NOT saying in the DOI is that our rights come from God (the Christian God as the RWers would have you believe). They were REJECTING the idea of "Divine Right". The Founders believed that Reason, and reason alone, would reveal what our rights are. The DOI and The Constitution were products of The Enlightenment. The idea that our source of wisdom and knowledge is not revealed to us by some deity but that REASON is where knowledge and reason comes from.

The DOI says that "We hold these truths to be self evident". The word evident has the same root (obviously) as evidence. The Founders did not depend on God to reveal our rights...they depended on their own reasoning to determine them.

Despite what the Bible says, Proverbs 3:5 "Trust in the Lord with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding." that is exactly what the Founding Fathers did, trusted their own understanding of how the world works and what is good.

 

The King represented the Government at the time. They didn't reject the origin of rights coming from God, they rejected the idea that it came from any form of government; including that of a monarch.

 

DeSantis is a hypocrite. He is quoting God but his actions are Godless.

 

Let me speak for DeSantis and other conservatives. Our rights come from God means our rights are preordained and can't be reduced by government.

 

What is Godless about what Desantis has done as Governor? Please be specific.

 

No, it means your rights are essentially laws and laws are meaningless if not enforced.

 

You have it backwards. Laws are enacted to protect the rights we have. Not to enforce those rights.

 

Yet the Bible says all governments are instituted by God and that it is a sin to rebel against them. Weird. This is part of why Divine Command Theory is one of the dumbest ethical theories imaginable.

 

Yes that is how it works, conceptually speaking. But in essence, the laws that carve out those rights for you, protect what you can do, penalize what you can't, those are what make rights tangible. Without the enforcement of the law, we have no rights. Those rights aren't just floating around independent of us. We invented them, we codified them, and we protect them with enforcement.

I can walk around all day saying I have the right to do this, or the right to do that, but it doesn't make it true. Only if we have enshrined those rights within a framework of law and have the means to see that they are enforced. A right that is not enforced might as well not even exist. For all intents and purposes, the outcome and the effect is the same in both situations.

If you need proof of this, find a third world country and remind them they all have the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. They'll look at you like you just told them to fill their bellies by wishing on stars.

 

Why are the only options God and government. Seems like a silly assumption, and certainly an unsubstantiated one. And most of the rights we enjoy today were outlawed by God, according to the Bible.

 

FYI, few people agree on the same religious beliefs, and fewer people are associated with religion. Atheists have nothing to do with God either.

So basically DeSantis is once again shooting his mouth off.

 

You are defeating your own argument. In essence what you're saying (highlighted in bold) is that a right is recognized which is then protected by a law. Or you could ask: Which came first -- the right or the law protecting the right?

 

It makes sense, Almighty decided He wants Biden.

 

Which is laughable

 

Good luck find any religious scriptures that agree with you. DeSantis is Christian. In his scriptures, freedom of speech and freedom of religion were punishable by death.

 

He may be a Christian, but apparently (and unsurprisingly), he's a **** writer

https://www.yahoo.com/news/york-times-shreds-ron-desantis-111436677.html

 

@DaveBN knows the definition, but, like me, he is probably wondering how rights endowed by the creator could be denied to native americans, slaves, women, etc by the same enlightened founders who decided the rights must come from god in the first place.

 

Come on people. The notion of rights is a human construct and throughout history those in power decided what they are and mean. Sure there have been thinkers who tried to attribute them to nature, God etc. but that does not make their premise valid or true. Each organized society through the power that rules it what rights it recognizes, how it protects them and and who can exercise them. In a free society where people actually hold the power, such as in the US, we the people, through our representatives, form(ed) our social compact adopted our Constitution and are living by it and even so we got some of it wrong at times.

 

Then again, who interpreted for you and your specific narrative and chosen agenda