then you think sex should be done in public? please expalain to me how a homosexual female drives a car differently than a straigth female, or eats her dinner then, please explain how they have sex. Uh oh, there is the one and ONLY difference I wish you well trying to condemn people because we don't see you as being special. We see just as everyone else. I don't come to you and say "hi, I'm a straight man and don't need you to come to me and say, hi, i'm a homosexual man" SInce we eat the same, drink the same then the only thing you are saying is that you engage in sex with other men. Nothing else is learned by telling me that you are gay. Keep tossing out the insults and labels at me all that you want. You have your opinon, I think they are a bit askew of reality. I have my opinion and you despise me because it differs form yours. tolerance.....pffftttt
and your points are based upon how only YOU see the world. You do not know with 100% certainty how anyone else really thinks. I don't insult you or call you myopic or egocentric because your opinion differs from mine and others.
You didn't address any of the many ways that a person's sexuality impacts their day to day lives that I enumerated, so it seems you are afraid of confronting the issue honestly. That's a shame, and it shows you are unwilling to really engage the topic, or are actually as ignorant as you are portraying yourself to be. People have pictures of their spouse on their desk. Would you forbid that of gay people? What about all the rights that straight people inherit through marriage. Would you give these to gay couples as well? You say you are ok with the hand holding and goodbye pecks that others take for granted. Are you ok with these for gay people, or must they hide these benign expressions of affection behind the bedroom door? I don't despise you. I hope I can make you see that you have not thought out your position very well. If you think you have, address the issues in the post, not your anger at having your position questioned. That is all we are seeing in your response. Avoidance and anger. Defend your position if you can. Engage the questions. You make a silly assumption that I am gay myself. My girlfriend of six years sits beside me and I am the proud dad of a high school senior girl. Straight men can support the freedom of others. I hope you try it.
Thank you for being a decent, compassionate and reasonable human being!! I cannot tell you how much I appreciate that.
Absent a smart retort you parse my statement with critique. Clever, but I'm hardly intimidated and it doesn't alter the reality of two guys close dancing at a redneck bar in Enterprise, Alabama. Of that I'm 100% certain. Until that reality is changed there is no equality. That being the case, members of the GLBTQ community have a right to publicly seek redress of their grievances, your personal sensitivities notwithstanding. Requiring a gay sexual orientation to remain in the bedroom is the very same thing requiring gays to remain in the closet. Your position is egocentric. That is not an insult, it simply means you see the world as you experience it and don't allow others, even those who have personal experience with the subject at hand, to modify or influence your perception. While no one knows absolutely what others are thinking, if you listen to what they say you can come up with a fairly accurate assessment; if you do so with an open mind you might even learn something and broaden the way you see things. The bottom line is humans have always divided themselves up into groups. There is a society for every profession extant, even for prostitutes. There are so many religions and sub-religions that even theology scholars can't keep track of them. People feel comfortable around others who share their interests, beliefs, cultures, and communities. When you are a part of a group by accident of birth and that group is attacked or repressed the natural human response is to draw closer together, identify with each other more closely and strengthen your bonds. So if you want to see the GLBTQ community fade into the shadows the best way is to recognize it, grant it equal status and make certain that society doesn't attack it due to its status as "other".
As to the idea that gay people are trying to separate themselves, allowing their sexuality to define them: A person's sexuality is a part of what defines them. How big a part varies from person to person, gay or straight. I am a man who is gay, among other things. It is not the prime focus of my existence. I will not deny that some gay people have embraced their marginalization. I am not one of them. In my experience, the separating is mostly done by prejudiced people who cannot see beyond our orientation. To them, it is the thing that defines us, regardless of where it ranks in our personal priorities. They do not care to know anything else about us. They focus on our orientation, and then proceed to tell us how and what we think, make biased generalizations that ignore our diversity, etc. Like I said before: blind spots.
frankly, that right there should scare the heck out of you. You want to legislate people's thoughts. It might be OK for your agenda on this but what if the same thought police want to do it to you for a different topic where you feel you should be allowed to think your own thoughts?
really, now you are starting to sound like me!!! I could care what you do in the bedroom. THat is not what is you. Do you steal? Do you open the door for a person when their hands are full? Do you give up your seat to an older person or mom with kids? Do you volunteer? It's those things which make up you. But, for some reason, in this thread and many others, and the gay marches etc etc only the sexual difference is mentioned. Otherwise, it would be a bunch of people just marching or protesting for who knows what. How you or I have sex does not define us. I don't understand nor ever will why you feel it's important for me to know how you have sex. It won't change my opinion of you. Now, if you stole from me then that would change my opinion.
I think you are the one that hasn't really thought it thru. When was the last time you saw a city in the MidWest close down part of it's downtown so the straight people could urinate and ejaculate on each other in public? walk around nude or in fetish clothing? The 'gay ghetto' has created those images for itself, it seems a bit hypocritical for you to call those that associate being gay with those images as 'homophobes'. It is the image the media uses, it is the lifestyle supported by leaders of the gay community. Can you name me more than a handful of gay leaders that have never endorsed these things? If you don't like the baggage, work in your own community to clean it up rather than defend it or call all criticism of it 'homophobia'. when someone says "Keep it in the bedroom"; he's thinking of those images...not of some guy giving another a peck at the airport.
Homosexuality isn't a "lifestyle". And not all homosexual people (as you imply) must answer for what some of them do. If one applied something similar to ALL HETEROSEXUALS, the ridiculousness or fallacy of what you submitted above, would be much more evident.
Why do you suppose I am advocating public ejaculation? Where did you get that from my post? Reactionary drivel. Address what I said, not what you wish I had.
A child is a developing person. As such she or he has yet to reach his or her full potential. As any child matures different facets of personality and adult traits will be added, modified or altered. While a child's sexuality may be determined, its influence in defining the individual will unfold and evolve with time. Much the same way intelligence manifests itself. At 3 a child may have an I.Q. of 150, but at 40 that same intelligence will express itself in different and more expansive ways than it did at 3. This seems and should be apparent. That you raise such a point is questionable. Are you being deliberately nit-picky because you have difficulty arguing your point of view or are you just obtuse?
What a ridiculous argument. Who are the gay leaders that have endorsed those things, and what makes you think they represent all but a handful of gay leadership? You're blowing so much smoke that i'm surprised you aren't choking on it. Newsflash: A lot of gay people have moved out of the "gay ghettoes", and there are quite a few of us who never lived in one in the first place. The idea that individuals who live on the other side of the country in a different state are somehow responsible for "cleaning up" the behavior of others with whom they have no association is ridiculous. And I'm not responsible for anyone's bigotry or misconceptions based on their failure to apply critical thinking.
Let's begin with your distortions. Cite verifiable proof of any gay pride march that has featured individuals urinating or ejaculating, much less on each other. Have you ever attended a gay pride march or are you relying on six o'clock news coverage and your own prurient imagination? Admittedly there are some exuberant expressions of youthful sexuality and near nudity (the same as might be seen on any beach) and these visual bites are what local news editors seem to prefer displaying. That is hardly the sum of a gay pride march. There are far more serious expressions of the GLBTQ community to be seen, like marching groups of gay veterans, police officers, firefighters; there's P-Flag members showing support for their gay children, siblings, and friends; there are groups representing every major religion: Catholics, Episcopalians, Mormons, Baptists, Jews, Buddhists, and many more including the predominantly gay Metropolitan Community Church. There are also groups representing the major professions: teachers, lawyers, doctors, nurses, social workers, etc. So paint your sordid picture elsewhere because it does not represent the GLBTQ community. Of course there are parades that do focus on the baser, more decadent displays of human behavior and sexuality. Admittedly they do involve total nudity (and reward it) and I have personally seen sexual acts publicly displayed. Unfortunately, from your point of view, you cannot lay these spectacles at the gay doorstep. I'm referring, of course, to Mardi Gras and Carnival, the two biggest examples of which are in New Orleans and Rio de Janeiro. I belief the expression is that people who live in glass houses...what I'd like to say to you is that gay or straight human behavior is much the same. When you try to make the seamier aspects exclusive to gays you've become homophobic. ***** The so called "gay ghetto" that exist in some of our major cities came into being in part because there is safety in numbers. If you were a member of a group that faced frequent assaults, discrimination in housing, prejudice and hostility from neighbors, you too would likely seek out neighborhoods where others of your group live. It has nothing to do with sexuality and everything to do with safety. I don't know what you think or imagines goes on in a "gay ghetto," but I can assure you that life is as routine as any other neighborhood with the exception that couples are more often paired up male with male and female with female. I lived in the West Village (Greenwich) for a good number of years and it was an extremely pleasant place to live and be; super shops, outstanding restaurants, lots of great entertainment and clubs. If it was as you imagined I doubt that heterosexual couples, many with children would also opt to live or spend there. When you suggest that we should "clean up" our neighborhoods I'm not certain if you mean it literally or metaphorically. In either case it does not apply and is rather insulting (or one might say homophobic). If you mean metaphorically, gay urban neighborhoods don't differ from other urban neighborhoods in any substantial way. If you mean literally then you are so far off the mark as to be self-imbarassing. Whenever an urban community has evolved into a gay neighborhood invariably the housing stock improves and values increase. Look at any urban area where gentrification has taken place and you will note a substantial gay presence. So much so that when Baltimore officials set about to revitalize parts of their city it solicited gay couples and gave them decrepit houses to restore with the hope of bringing back blighted neighborhoods. ******** Gay people cannot control what some heterosexuals imagine about us and the way we lead our lives. I can say, based on what you have written, that your perception and the reality are an ocean's width apart. In essence we are human beings. We have the same strengths and weaknesses as heterosexual human beings. Recent research has revealed that straight men and gay men are more similar to each other in their sexual approach, desires and fantasies than either are to women. The main difference being, of course, that straight men were attracted to women while gay men to other men. The same held true for women. Lesbians had more in common sexually with each other than with men. The main difference between gay men and straight men (aside from the obvious gender attraction) was that gay men actuated their desires and fantasies with far greater frequency than straight men. The reason was not sexual orientation, but rather the gender of their partners. Gay men, pairing with other men, had partners far more willing; straight men, pairing with women, had far less willing partners. As one woman reviewing the data stated: All men, straight or gay, are dogs. What I'm saying is that there is far more that makes us alike than different. The perception problem seems to center on the typical, paternalistic, straight male who has a great deal of difficulty when he thinks of sexual activity between two males. It makes some squeamish, others confused and still others hostile and angry, if not a combination of all three. Seldom does it stimulate a positive reaction and that is a definition of homophobic. It's ironic because many, and perhaps most straight men find the idea of lesbian sexual action to be highly erotic. The baggage that needs shedding is your stereotypical, superficial thinking because that is homophobia. Neither you nor anyone else can label and box us into one set of behaviors or a single philosophy. Beyond being sexually attracted to persons of the same gender we are as varied as our heterosexual counterparts. Are there some people with sexual perversions? You bet there are and they can be found in approximately the same percentages among both straight and gay. Are there some people who are giving, loving and generous? You bet there are and they too rank among straight and gay people. We keep our sexuality in the bedroom just as heterosexuals do. That you see a difference is homophobic.
Folsom St Fair. It's been discussed within this forum. If you want , feel free to search this site. Links to sites with graphic images were provided; it's not pretty. So, spare us your faux outrage as if it does not happen because nobody personaly provided you a link.
That fair is not a gay pride event. Its a bondage/bdsm fair. It's a fetish parade, not a gay pride parade. You do realize there is a difference?
please explain to me how grown men walking around naked with woodies, performing fellatio upon each other, inserting aforementioned woody into the anal region of each other, and those same guys going up onto porches and stroking aforementioned woodies until they spurt upon the crowd and doing that in the open in front of even children, is not homosexual sex? Maybe you are right, maybe I'm sadly mistaken and those guys are just misunderstood.
