The Grim Reality of Covid-19 - A Dire Warning to us All!

Discussion in 'Coronavirus Pandemic Discussions' started by Derideo_Te, Mar 10, 2020.

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  1. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Congressional bills always have riders that are unrelated. That's not new and it is certainly not specific to one party.

    And, I believe that there WAS progress in adding components to the bill to make life more possible for those on low income who lost jobs, can not pay for hospital visits, don't have sick leave, etc.

    I don't know what the hangup is right now.

    PreCOVID there were 87,000 flights per day and the total greenhouse gas pollution turns out to be noticable. I know that not everyone gives a crap about climate change, but science certainly does.
     
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  2. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Well, Ford says they don't need help, because they saw the news and prepared for it.

    And, my comments were directed more to larger corporations as I noted by mentioning small business.
     
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  3. AmericanNationalist

    AmericanNationalist Well-Known Member

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    I care about the climate and environment, and it may even play a part in this war against coronavirus. But now wasn't the time, the time to debate those measures is when we win this war.
     
  4. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Ford may not need help. That does not mean that all corporations should not need help.

    I don't need help. Does that mean that all private citizens should have prepared better so that they do not need help? The same argument could be made for individuals that you are making for corporations.
     
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2020
  5. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    Yes. That's true for pretty much every rider that has ever been passed.

    The general problem is that congress has limited capacity and needs to retain focus on more serious problems. So, if there is any actual disagreement, a small bill is never going to see the light of day on its own.
     
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  6. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    The help being negotiated for workers is for those who don't have discretionary income that makes personal planning for this disaster a possibility.

    Ford CAN (and did) make plans for this disaster. They have capacity and have a track record of taking measures on their own rather than failing to plan and then begging for help.
     
  7. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So you believe that all corporations are equal just like all people are equal and have equal ability to weather disasters like this? Too bad the world doesn't actually work that way.

    It still comes back to basics. If a corporation goes broke, its people no longer have jobs and stockholders lose all their money.
     
  8. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    You can go ahead and believe what I said.

    So, since capitalism isn't good enough, how would YOU choose which corporations should die and which we should each give a hunk of of our money to corporate officials and stockholders?
     
  9. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Where Have I said capitalism isn't good enough? I am not even sure what that means.

    I have said that just because Ford can make it, and that is questionable., it does not mean that all corporations should be able to make it. As far as which corporation gets a bail out, there is no simple answer.
     
  10. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    It would be accurate to say that those that get sick from the virus and seek medical treatment have a death rate of 3 percent. This is very important without knowing how many have it but is no worse than the common cold. People that catch the flu virus dont seek medical care unless really sick . Most just get bed rest for a few days as I did in 73 from the London flu. And I have never been that ill in my life of 75 years and soon to be 76 .

    So these death numbers are relevant. ..right ?
     
  11. One Mind

    One Mind Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    That stock market is a reflection of the war on working and tthe middle class and the disembowelling of America by both parties and a few elites . It once reflected how main street was doing as well as working Americans. That is no longer the case .

    And so if we are ever to reverse what neoliberalism and its globalism that created that giant sucking sound perot tried to warn us about the stock market needs to bottom out and economy crashes giving us another great depression . Where we can no longer afford to give our elites max profits and greater wealth at the expense of our middle class and workers.

    Only this stands a chance of reversing what the treason of neoliberal globalism has wrought
     
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  12. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    As per usual your grasp of the relevant Subject Matter is lacking which makes any discussion pointless.

    Here are the FACTS!

    A corporation is LEGAL ENTITY that is SEPARATE and DISTINCT from it's owners.
     
  13. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    I don't care what you call it or how you characterize it. If the corporation goes bust, I lose my life savings as will many other people. . It is a life savings which my wife will need when I pass away because much of my retirements benefits expire when I expire. In addition when the corporation goes bust, employees lose their jobs.
     
  14. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    Also. Keep this in mind. This occurred through no fault of the corporations. They have been told to shut down by the US government and their employees have been told to stay home by the US government.
     
  15. Derideo_Te

    Derideo_Te Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for establishing that you lack the relevant subject matter knowledge to discuss this topic as far as I am concerned.

    Have a nice day!
     
  16. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    In other words, you have no meaningful response..

    Thank you for clearing that up.
     
  17. Space_Time

    Space_Time Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if the pandemic will really end this way:

     
  18. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    We gave Mnuchin hunddreds of billions of dollars to spend on corporations as he sees fit. While we will know how he chose to spend our tax dollars, he's free to do it as he wants.

    Cool job! And, I'll bet he has friends.

    The point is that corporations CAN plan for disasters such as this

    And, if we just keep bailing them out when they choose not to, this is will always be the problem.

    At the Bush crash, there were Republicans who opposed massive bailouts to banks, big auto, etc.

    Where did those Republicans go??? What happened to capitalism?
     
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  19. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    My best hope is that THIS time we'll remember and will do the work to be prepared for the next such event.

    That we've refused to listen to experts on the need to be prepared for this is absolutey abysmal and needs to be considered totally unacceptable.

    There are still some really bad signs, too. The USA is doing worse than other countries, yet our president lobbies hard to give up the fight inistead of rallying us against what even he considers an enemy.
     
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  20. Pycckia

    Pycckia Well-Known Member

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    Science does not give a crap about climate change. Science is incapable of giving a crap about anything. "Science" is an abstract noun.
     
  21. kriman

    kriman Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    So can people. We shouldn't be handing out money to anyone. How about them apples?
     
  22. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    I've agreed twice already that there are businesses that could not prepare for what we face.

    However, there are those like Ford who can and didn't. This is twice now that Ford has done the work to stay alive when others could have, but didn't. Capitalism would reward that behavior. But, we're going to prop up those who didn't bother.

    That's true for our nation as a whole, too. We've been warned over and over that this would come. But, we found those working on having a response for America and fired them. We know the solution, but accept leadership that suggest we should stop fighting - even as we're doing worse than other countries.
     
  23. WillReadmore

    WillReadmore Well-Known Member

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    I agree it's a usage that is a shortcut.

    It's clear what is meant.
     
  24. Pycckia

    Pycckia Well-Known Member

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    Not to me. Give me the explicated version.
     
  25. Surfer Joe

    Surfer Joe Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    The virus deniers are plumbing new depths of stupidity and selfishness, even for reactionaries, but it may prove especially tragic in the US because of our opulent lifestyle.
    Obese people, particularly morbidly obese ones, are the ones who are at biggest risk to suffer complications if they contract coronavirus, and the US is the fattest country on earth.
     
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