Today, 135 years since the birth of Joseph Stalin.

Discussion in 'Russia & Eastern Europe' started by Destroyer of illusions, Dec 21, 2014.

  1. Kiwi33

    Kiwi33 New Member

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    Japanese didn't capitulate when on Hiroshima dropped bombs. Yes it shook some leaders, but before, Americans burned out many Japanese cities by Firebombing. The cities were burned as well as Hiroshima. Japanese the only country in wars of history where suicide bombers were in large quantities used. Japanese though it was strongly weakened by Americans, but as well as in Japan and in the countries of Southeast Asia there was very big Japanese army. Even after it is prompt, it is skillful and unexpected for Japanese, the Soviet army hurt them (after capitulation of Japan) 225 thousand Japanese soldiers still bore "security service". (Japanese didn't want to believe in defeat and because of a bad connection)
     
  2. vis

    vis Well-Known Member

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    We talk not about France, but about Russia. Yet, Hitler attacked Great Britain although he had a pact with Stalin.
     
  3. Korozif

    Korozif Banned

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    They had no ships left to repatriate those troops in china and Russia didn't have any navy worth mentionning in the pacific to carry its own troop to invade japan. The pacific theather was fought 99% by the american and won 100% by the american.
     
  4. Korozif

    Korozif Banned

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    Man, you should really read up on WW2. Hitler attacked Great Britain AFTER THE FALL OF FRANCE on June 25, 1940. Russia was still an ally to germany providing food, fuel and ammunition to the germans! And they did so until the very day they were themselve attacked.

    The Battle of Britain, started in July 1940.
     
  5. vis

    vis Well-Known Member

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    Russia was never in alliance with Germany: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II
    The fact, that Germany attacked France does not prove that Germany would not attack Soviet Union if they did not have the peace treaty.
     
  6. KSigMason

    KSigMason Banned at Members Request Past Donor

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    Having studied Russian politics and history, f*** Stalin!
     
  7. Korozif

    Korozif Banned

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    Read up on Ribbentrop-Molotov pact and the partition of Poland... Russia was germany's ally from 1939 to 41.
     
  8. vis

    vis Well-Known Member

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    Peace treaty does not make the countries allies. There was no military treaty between Germany and USSR, which made the countries real alliance.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Peace treaty does not make the countries allies. There was no military treaty between Germany and USSR, which made the countries real alliance. It is opposite, before 1939 USSR took part in the wars against Germany alliance (civil war in Spain) and war with Japan on the Far East of USSR.
     
  9. Korozif

    Korozif Banned

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    It wasn't a peace treaty, it was a pact, just like Italy, Romania, Bulgaria, Japan signed pact with the nazy, so did russia. They were allied in their partitioning of poland. Russia provided food, fuel, ammo and natural ressources to germany until the day they were attacked themselves. Stalin played the russian people and sacrificed a lot of innocents to satisfy his ego.
     
  10. vis

    vis Well-Known Member

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    I do not understand your point. You believe that it was better that this pact or whatever they call it was not signed by USSR?
     
  11. Kiwi33

    Kiwi33 New Member

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    Would what happened if Americans attack on Japan and to Asia themselves ? I will answer if it isn't right, correct me. By Firebombing destroyed more than Hiroshima, but it didn't stop resistance of Japanese. Japanese would resist long on the land, against one Americans.

    Besides, when interrogated the former Japanese military, they spoke - if quickly Soviet army didn't attack (they didn't expect in difficult passable district, on off road terrain which defense was prepared by some years, will appear so quickly Soviet), and so, Japanese planned to use the bacteriological weapon against the USSR and other countries. Japanese kamikazes, could bring him anywhere.

    Heads of Three Great Powers - the Soviet Union, the United States of America and Great Britain prepared together that in two-three months after capitulation of Germany and the end of war in Europe the Soviet Union will enter war against Japan under the laid-down conditions...

    For only a few weeks of the USSR, well planned operation - having quickly separated Japanese in Manzhouli (bombing aircraft etc) together with Mongols etc. reached the Kuril Islands. Americans continued war in coastal Japan. Japanese leaders understood that it is the end. Were already ready to capitulation. At this time Americans dropped a bomb on Hiroshima. There is no final answer and to a question of, whether there was a military sense in nuclear bombing of Hiroshima. Also, Discussions of historians are still divided, whether it was necessary to drop an atomic bomb on Japan at the end of World War II.
    The USSR helped the allied countries, ''identical'' as they helped with defeat of fascist Germany.
     
  12. Korozif

    Korozif Banned

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    If russia hadn't signed that pact, Hitler wouldn't have invaded Poland because that would have been a repeat of WW1 with a war on two front. By signing that pact it gave Hitler the go ahead for invading poland since neither France or England could reinforce Poland.

    With Russia staying neutral and out of Poland, the baltic states and Finland, the allies, France and UK would have had more option open to them. If russia had entered the war in 1939 beside the French and UK, the Nazy would have folded in a matter of weeks because they didn't have the ressources like fuel to go on an extended campaign. Their only source of fuel was in Romania and the russian could've cut it quickly in 1939.
     
  13. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    If Stalin didn't make a treaty with Hitler, Hitler wouldn't have invaded Poland.

    And a lot of lives would have been spared.
     
  14. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    tens of millions killed while Stalin was in power.

    but you will never believe it, as you think Stalin is God.
     
  15. vis

    vis Well-Known Member

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    Why it was a war on two fronts, if Russia did not sign a treaty? Russia was not in alliance with GB or France, so in any case it would stay away and did not hit Germany from Polish side. And Hitler started a war with Poland knowing that it has a treaty with GB and France about cooperation, so it was already potential war on two fronts in any case, with treaty or without it.
    Stalin was not sure that Japan would start a war at that time, so for him it was important to secure the peace in the western borders.
    And if Germany started war with USSR in 1939, noone helped it. GB even did not help defend Poland, with whom it had an agreement, so less it would help USSR. And the war between USSR and Germany started in 1939, Soviet Union for sure would lost with all the industry located closely to the western borders and condition of the army. War in Finland actually showed that the army is not ready to fight with the best army of Europe of that time- German army.
    In any case, I am sure Stalin and Soviet Ministry of Foreign Affairs had their solid reasoning to sign the treaty. It is always easy to blame anyone for questionable decisions afterwards. As they say in this case, history does not tolerate subjunctive mood.
     
  16. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You guys defending Stalin is no better than Germans defending Hitler.

    shame on you.
     
  17. Korozif

    Korozif Banned

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    Uk couldn't help Poland because of the German-Russia pact, as it would have made uk declare war on Russia too... You should study this subject more before trying to debate on it.
     
  18. Kiwi33

    Kiwi33 New Member

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    - What you think - Stalin was good or bad? - ask me.

    The matter is that the similar question immediately revives in my memory far February evening 1945 in the Crimea. I, during that time the young scientist-anti-occultist, was invited to one of Party of allies. Near me someone sighed and said: "I don't understand how they can talk to this executioner of the people".

    I look back. Speaking it was swarthy - later I repeatedly went to it to the Bombay university for exchange of experience.

    - You understand, smart guy like me not ready to keep up the conversation about my leader in such tone. - I answered.

    - What your leader? - the Hindu was surprised. - I say about Churchill.

    He spoke, and real, uncut version of Churchill rose before me to the utmost. The young aristocrat began the career with suppression of revolt of Jose Marty in Cuba and retaliatory operations in Sudan - against Latinos and Blacks who didn't make to it anything bad. Then he participated in genocide of boer. Then, as could, he smothered Irish, Somalis, Rhodesians and Hindus. Diving and coming up from the power, it drove from the earth of hungry Kenyans, sent English homeless children in thousands in the Australian labor colonies, bombed refugees in Dresden, rushed with the project of sterilization of 100 thousand "defective" compatriots and the conclusions them in special concentration camps, both other, and other. "And you know, what he told about us, Hindus? "The stupid race rescued only by the reproduction from destiny which she deserved" - the doctor read on memory.

    - Churchill and his empire plunder half a billion people, spoil the won countries, kill with millions, cut out color of the local nations - and all of you think that he is the dear smart uncle in the cylinder. - with bitterness doctor Kumar finished. - here you will see, in a year he again will declare you devils and will try to isolate from the world. After about 50 years in honor of a victory over Hitler in London will deliver it a monument - to him and Roosevelt.
    http://pikabu.ru/story/pro_repressii_stalina_i_cherchillya_ne_opravdyivayu_repressii_no_tem_ne_menee_2282481
     
  19. vis

    vis Well-Known Member

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  20. Korozif

    Korozif Banned

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  21. Destroyer of illusions

    Destroyer of illusions Banned

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    Once again - Again stupid propaganda. Can you prove it?
     
  22. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    you think its "propaganda" to say that Stalin killed millions of people??????

    sounds like Holocaust Denial.
     
  23. vis

    vis Well-Known Member

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  24. Ronstar

    Ronstar Well-Known Member Past Donor

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    You can't blame Stalin's crimes on anyone but Stalin.

    Had he not made a non-aggression pact with Hitler, Hitler would not have invaded Poland.
     
  25. Destroyer of illusions

    Destroyer of illusions Banned

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    In other words - you can not prove anything. And continues stupid propaganda.

    P/S:
    Why do you always allude to the myth of the Holocaust? We have already found that the Holocaust - it myth. For deceive the world's population.
     

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