Trump failed to secure the border. What makes you think he will succeed if re-elected?

Discussion in 'Elections & Campaigns' started by robini123, Apr 7, 2024.

  1. robini123

    robini123 Well-Known Member

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    I prefer to look at the long history of failures of both parties to secure our borders.
     
  2. FatBack

    FatBack Well-Known Member

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    Well you say that but your OP focuses entirely on Republicans.

    I would like a permanent solution but it appears that we're not going to get that, so your left choosing which one sucks less.
     
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  3. robini123

    robini123 Well-Known Member

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    Indeed as I was raised Christian conservative and spent most of my life believing the right wing dogma I was taught and accepted uncritically. I have always has problems with the left. Unfortunately it took 40 years for my Christian conservative indoctrination to wear off thus allowing me to see that much of the crap the left does that bothers me is the same crap the right does. Lesson learned is that loyalty blinds and that only trusting the in-group is a good way to reinforce bias.

    I focus my criticism on the right because it is the right I have watch decline from a political force worthy of my respect to a political force that is moving too close to authoritarianism for my comfort. I miss the days when I respected the RNC. Now it sickens me.

    As for your last statement, I say there is a third option, a third party. Not sure it matters though as a third party would sooner or later be corrupted by power just as the left and right have. Human nature is predictable once you know where a person’s loyalties lie. Regrettably human nature always devolves into some form of authoritarianism eventually as democracy goes against our tribal nature.
     
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  4. Melb_muser

    Melb_muser Well-Known Member Donor

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    There are multiple factors at play, but a lot less hit the border under Trump. It's not a natural experiment that I like to see, but if Trump does get in and then numbers reduce again, I guess it won't be a coincidence this time...
     
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  5. Junkieturtle

    Junkieturtle Well-Known Member Donor

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    It's in both parties interests to keep the issue as a hot button vote driver that can trotted out every 2 years as a cudgel to beat the other guy with. Just like abortion and gay rights were.
     
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  6. JohnHamilton

    JohnHamilton Well-Known Member

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    Trump made an effort to control the problem. Biden has opened border. His toady, Mayorikis, has constantly lied to Congress with the line, “The border is closed.” That’s why he’s been impeached, but Biden is ultimately guilty.
     
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  7. MiaBleu

    MiaBleu Well-Known Member

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    Interesting point. What would be the influencing factor that reduces the numbers under Trump (if he gets in) Would "fear" of Trump be a factor?? Or some other variable??
     
  8. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    Immigration has historically been a low priority issue for voters of both parties, so usually elections are not going to swing on that issue. But I don't think we've had a moment when the Democratic activists on immigration have been given almost total carte blanche to dictate policy until this administration.

    Still, even if many Democrats don't like what's happening at the border, I think the party has made the bet that they are not going to jump on the Trump train because of it. "Sensible immigration and border policy, but at the cost of the end of Our Democracy and Hitler like dictatorship? No thanks!"

    So you'll just have to be frustrated and vote blue no matter who.
     
  9. robini123

    robini123 Well-Known Member

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    Unsuccessful efforts do not impress me. I want real solutions. Don’t you? Pointing out the failure of the left does nothing to address the failure of the right to secure our borders. Seems to me all the right wants to do is blame the left while continuing to fail themselves to secure the border. It blows my mind that the right is so tolerant and forgiving of the continual failure of Republicans and MAGA to secure the border.
     
  10. robini123

    robini123 Well-Known Member

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    Never voted blue and likely never will. I will either waste my vote on a 3rd party or stay home and get drunk.
     
  11. JohnHamilton

    JohnHamilton Well-Known Member

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    I have read enough posts to know your game. You are a progressive Democrat who is here to fool people into voting for Biden because you claim that there is not difference between Trump and Biden on the border and many other issues.

    10 million illegal aliens have crossed the border since Biden took office. When the State of Texas tried to enforce the border because the Biden administration has refused to do it, the Biden administration has taken the State of Texas to court. That's all you need to know about what the Biden administration border policy is ... OPEN BORDERS.
     
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  12. JohnHamilton

    JohnHamilton Well-Known Member

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    That sounds like a plan to me because you sure aren't going to help us out when it comes to sending Biden back to Delaware where he belongs.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2024
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  13. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    He won't. He can't. He will still be bound by USA laws and international laws we agreed to.

    It's nothing but a political football.
    Also, he needs those employees for his golf courses and hotels.
     
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  14. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    Can you cite some statistics to back up that nonsense?
    Credible sources required.
     
  15. JohnHamilton

    JohnHamilton Well-Known Member

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    It's no nonsense; it's the truth.
     
  16. Lil Mike

    Lil Mike Well-Known Member

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    I suppose that's an option too.
     
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  17. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    OK, it's made up no nonsense.
    Thx.
     
  18. JohnHamilton

    JohnHamilton Well-Known Member

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    Debating you is like trying to drain the ocean with a teaspoon. You are a progressive Democrat, and that's the end of the debate.
     
  19. robini123

    robini123 Well-Known Member

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    I am a former Christian conservative that has never supported the left. I am now a moderate and closer to libertarians than Democrats or Republicans. Partisans on the right label me liberal while partisan liberals label me conservative.

    I never claimed there are no differences between Biden or Trump, because that would be a silly argument to make. Pointing out the fact that both sides fail to secure the border does not mean that they fail for the same reason and to the same degree.

    As for Texas, I support their efforts to secure the border. I also support transporting illegals from border States to liberal sanctuary cities.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2024
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  20. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    You mean that would be true for everyone who asks for data to back up a claim.
    There's no debate with those who just make stuff up.

    You are all about fake news and can't back up any claims, ever.
    Because it's all made up.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2024
  21. JohnHamilton

    JohnHamilton Well-Known Member

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    Ditto to you. It's time to put you on ignore again.

    You know why the Democrats are letting millions of illegals into the country as well as I do. Since it furthers your political goals, you are all for it.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2024
  22. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    That's the best post you've ever made.
    It's tough isn't it, when asked to provide evidence of a claim. Especially when it's fake.
     
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  23. JohnHamilton

    JohnHamilton Well-Known Member

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    I'm glad I pleased you for once.
     
  24. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    Post real claims with data and facts and you can please all people who are into statistics based claims.
     
  25. dairyair

    dairyair Well-Known Member

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    We should put an end to political parties and vote for individuals.

    The parties are what has taken gov't away from the people and made it about their parties.
    Which, when it comes to reelection, each party is usually in almost total agreement.
     
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