Wasn't the Democratic Hoax supposed to go away after the election?

Wonderful logic

 

The amount of economic damage inflicted by Covid lock downs broadly depends on 3 factors key factors. Firstly quickly the lock down is imposed after the virus is detected together with how comprehensive the restrictions are. Secondly the willingness the general population to comply with those restrictions and support public hygiene measures. Lastly how much resources the State puts into contact tracing and how well organized those resources are.

If all three factors come in to play early and effectively you get a short/severe lock down followed by a faster opening up that limits the spread of the virus and thus the damage to the economy. Case in point in Australia, as of yesterday there hasn't been a single case of community transmission anywhere in the country and the economy is opening up. (Oh, the chances are high that there are still a tiny number of undetected cases out there but they will be jumped on with local measures if/when detected. We're currently tracking Covid traces in the sewage system on a suburb by suburb basis so we know in advance where there may be a problem and can ramp up free testing and calls for greater hygiene precautions in those locations.

Now contrast that result with America's, shall we say 'less than sterling' efforts to control the virus and the damage inflicted on the US economy as a result. America, with a larger, highly mobile population was always going to have a harder time controlling virus spread of course. Not least because we have more comprehensive national health care and welfare systems in place so the bureaucracy and IT needed for a national approach is already in situ. But when the outbreak started here the Federal Government called a meeting attended by all 8 State and Territory leaders and, politics aside they nutted out a national COVID strategy in a couple of days. It wasn't all smooth sailing, there were and are ongoing disputes/differences over virus policy measures between different States and between the States and the Federal Government but on the whole those have been minor. Again, compare that to how well national co-operation worked in the US.

And as should note from my response political partisanship should have nothing to do with the question. This is a public health issue, pure and simple, you either impose effective control measures or you don't. Democrats can do it, Republicans can do it, there's no ideological barrier to controlling a virus. Same way as they can fight forest fires crossing State borders without making it about politics. Recriminations can come later but deal with the real problem first. Finally the US economy will absolutely recover but the way politics was working there during the virus means it will take longer than it could have.

 

One last thing re the above two points. Firstly America's death toll is approaching what now 330,000? Your comment seems to imply that no American has any need to show concern or care for the welfare any other citizen. Which is not my experience of Americans as individuals BTW. What happens when one of your own gets seriously ill from this or the next infectious disease that comes along?

Secondly all our liberties are returning thank you, (step by step as we beat back the virus). The only constitutional 'right' currently limited here relates to interstate travel. All other rights are safely intact - there are inconveniences yes, concerning masks and signing in to public places etc but these are slowly being wound back to.

 

We have to sacrifice SOME things for security, or we will indeed have neither. We will be dead. People constantly forget that Franklins's famous aphorism refers to "necessary" freedoms, not trivial ones.

 

I suggest going back. Your Democrat party changed the narrative along with the complicit media

 

I hope that you never regret those words. all oppressive regimes have been leftist and claim to be in it for the people.

 

Those vaccines have a nightmare support requirement. Trumps current cluster muck up of an administration would fumble it for sure

 

My Democrat Party, what the Fook are you talking about

 

Burma, Turkey, Peru, Russia.

 

You have surrendered, this is not the US of A way. We do not surrender, we fight and we do what ever it takes to win the fight.
Were is that spirit, which made the US of A.

I do not surrender, I do what ever it takes and I am the foreigner in your country.
Me the foreigner who lives in this country for over 30 years has to teach you how to fight.
Really.
A Kraut ?
If you, my American neighbor want to MAGA, you have to get your f*** ars in gear and start fighting

Surrender, LOL, its time to fight and show your true colour, which is not the white flag, Stars and Stripes my man, Black Read and Yellow.
You have raised the White flag, you have surrendered, MAGA Man.

Not Me, I fly the Stars and Stripes on the top, CO in the middle and Black Red and Gold on the Bottom.
We never surrender till we get beaten into pulp.

 

Nixon sent teams of lawyers to a bunch of states, even Hawaii, looking for anything he could use to contest the election in court. He didn't find anything.

A couple decades ago, a team of historians went over the voting records, looking for corruption. They didn't find much.

That election is fascinating. It was pivotal because it was the first television debate, which helped JFK. But what put him over the edge was the internal politics within the Dem party.

You guys never let go of a conspiracy theory, it's quite the obsession.

 

venezuela cuba etc, any regime which feels the state is all powerful, is leftist. Socialism is leftist, think national socialist party aka NAZI

 

What? Your the one who claimed 'all oppressive regimes have been leftist' . When immediately given a list of governments (there are more BTW) that clearly refute this claim the statement above is the best response you can muster? No acknowledgement that yes, "there are oppressive right wing regimes and there always have been'." Or maybe perhaps "sorry I overstated my case. It's true that historically oppression shows no particular political bias but it is a common trait of all long term, socialist regimes (true BTW)"?

The best you can to is go running back to Hitler? The regimes in that list are not socialist but they are oppressive. Deal.

 

It only affected the country that is dependent on Western (World) government.
China does not care, that is why they have zero cases.

 

Or alternately its because they did have cases (lots of them) but went into lock-down and, being a Police State were able to do so far more quickly and effectively than most Western democracies.

Only a theory of course.

 

about 100,000 not 330000

 

There are some folks who will never understand, that social distancing and limiting gatherings is to slow down spread. NOT STOP IT.

So the healthcare system doesn't over load and people die in the aisle ways at hospitals.
So the healthcare workers stay as safe as possible and not have so many out sick they can't staff hospitals.

The virus itself will likely always be a part of our lives in some fashion.

 

Cept no one but you ever said such things.

 

Yes, I noticed my mistake after the time limit for editing had passed. I'll have to ask if that can be made longer. Fifteen minutes is, IMO too short, especially for longer pasts, although that may just be me. At the time the figure was about 230,000 not 330. I think the point the figure was being related to is still valid though.

 

then number of deaths due to COVID-19 is exaggerated by the media and politicians
COVID-19 is new virus and it is more aggressive then similar coronaviruses.
However people were dying from coronaviruses before COVID-19, so we have to subtract that number from 230,000.
At the end It will be about 100,000 extra deaths.

 

Err no. The media might want to exaggerate . The medical practitioners signing the death certificates and the coroners wont. And the figures I use when discussing COVID always come from official sources.

There is perhaps a margin for error say for example when you have someone who tests positive for COVID and has a significant comorbidity (think severe coronary artery disease, late stage cancer etc.) and then dies after apparently making an initial recovery from a mild infection. But you'd be fooling yourself if you believe its something live the 50% mark you seem to be claiming.

What you can't do is cross people of the list simply because say for example they have heart disease, then have a heart attack while suffering from COVID - and that's because the infection puts a strain on their system that would not otherwise be there. So it might not a have directly caused their death but that death would not have occurred if they had not been infected.

Bit like shooting someone then having them die in hospital a little while later from a heart attack. Even thought the direct cause of death is the heart attack, its the loss of blood from the gun shot would that induced the heart attack in the first place. So you might (And this is a WAG) be able to push the error rate out to somewhere up to say 10-15%. But there's no way you would get it has high as you seem to think. Especially as its hitting the frail and elderly the hardest - and they don't need much of a nudge to push them off the cliff.

 

Just exactly like the rightist ones. Hell, even monarchies claim to be doing everything for the good of the country.

Just about everybody on this board seems to be under the impression that Socialist, fascist, and capitalist means whatever they want it to. None of you have seemingly ever heard of a dictionary, let alone opened one and looked anything up.

 

You sound like an American patriot @gnoib. A rare bird these days, though many claim this.

 

In re this post I apologize. I had a household emergency and was called away suddenly and thought I had erased it. I didn't mean to insult everyone.

What I meant to say was could all of you PLEASE go to a dictionary and look these words up before you use them again. It's beginning to drive me crazy how everybody on this board just uses them in any way they please. They do have very established definitions and it can get very confusing

 

Trump had his chance and blew it - he had the resources, the power and unlimited press conferences to convince MSM and the American people that he had the ability to deal with the situation.