What is single payer?

ACA pretty much assured everyone in the US there would be no single payer for a long time to come. ACA has been a total disaster and the biggest reasons for that have been cost and govt involvement.

 

I think it might be helpful to know what it is and how it compares to Obamacare. I also think it might work because at this point Trump's proposals are idiotic.

We'll have to wait and see just how smart Trump is..

 

And seniors are having increasing difficulty find doctors that will accept medicare because it under values all services. It often doesn't even cover the actual cost of services rendered. And you think adding a bunch more people to a system that is already shaky at best is going to help precisely how? US hospital staff make two to three times their European equivalents. Anyway you go is going to be more expensive than in Europe.

 

In larger cities many practices have streamlined their delivery so they are perfectly willing to take Medicare patients.

 

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-doctor-shortage-chicago-clinic-met-20150319-story.html

Doctor shortages are only going to make care more expensive and there is no fix for that.

 

Why do you think we have so many ECFMG doctors in the US?

 

High pay, stable society, and educational opportunities. They will never make up the deficits though.

 

How many people do you know that can afford to pay for cancer treatment or openheart surgery out of pocket?

 

I'm not sure if I understand what you are saying or if you understand what I am saying.

We COULD simply calculate how much the government currently "pays in premium" for the people on Medicare now and use that as the premium payment for anyone that wants to buy into Medicare. It would only make Medicare stronger since there would be an influx of younger healthier participants and healthcare would be available to anyone.

Anyone who doesn't want that can simply buy their health insurance on the private market.

 

That's not true. If you give people the opportunity to NOT pay for something as intangible as insurance a lot of them will take that gamble .Doesn't matter if it's health insurance or car insurance.

That's fact. When I started driving in NJ you did NOT have to have insurance. If you had an accident judged to be your fault you lost your license until you paid for the damage you caused. A fair number of people took that option

 

Can you document that? Because I know MANY seniors (I'm 62) and none of them have trouble finding doctors

Oh and

US hospital staff make two to three times their European equivalents.

That's a big part of why our healthcare costs so much

 

2% levy on income for Australia, not 30%

https://www.ato.gov.au/Individuals/Medicare-levy/

 

Doesn't matter how great the service is, if you can't afford it the quality is irrelevant.

 

I don't know.. The maternal death rate in Texas is pretty horrible.

 

Wrong. A homeless person with no insurance and no money can walk into any US hospital and receive the best care the facility is capable of.
America is all about equal opportunity, not equal outcome.
If your mediocre equal slice of pie suits you, have at it.
We do absolutely everything better.

- - - Updated - - -

Source?

 

Absolutely.

And, that means ER and other health care costs are lost by hospitals in their patient's subsequent bankruptcy filings. Plus, there are the costs of collections pursuit, raising health care costs for those who are insured.

 

Margot, I have read many of your posts and you're a bright chick. Women in the US almost never die during childbirth in a hospital.
I'd like to see what provoked your comment.

 

Life insurance, car insurance, home insurance, and health insurance is business.
Consumers pay of their own volition.
Hospitals are obligated to stabilize people regardless of their ability to pay. Insired patients and their providers foot the bill.

 

Then why are your income taxes so high? I looked up Australian income taxes on Wikipedia to get that figure.

So if it's not medical care, what is it?

 

Single Payer is a euphemism for totalitarian government control of healthcare.

Sounds good, free healthcare for all. But there's no free lunch.

True, you will do away with the profit taking insurance companies, and replace them with useless ever expanding government bureaucracies and a burdensome regulatory agencies. Worse yet, you surrender control of your healthcare decisions to the government boards and bureaucrats. They could decide that your life isn't worth spending $20,000.00.

Ultimately, free healthcare is paid for by you, through your tax dollars. The poor end up being hurt the most, because any costs of products contain the hidden taxes, which the poor can afford the least.

When government takes over an industry, it tries to cut costs by limiting distribution, cutting production. In the healthcare industry, what this translates into is rationing of care.

Instead of introducing competition into insurance industries by allowing more companies to compete, which expands services and lowers costs through the power of capitalism, government take over of healthcare always results in lower quality product, scarcity of resources, reduction of services. Except for the wealthy, and the connected, the elites, who always seem to get special treatment because they will be given higher consideration due to their contribution to society and government revenues.

 

Every first world nation in the world sees health care as not just some product on the shelf in some store.

Health care isn't a choice. When your kid gets sick, you can't fix it by buying a toy or taking a vacation. The really great aspects of free market capitalism depend on that kind of choice - a choice that doesn't exist for health care.

When a product is not a choice, free market capitalism goes crazy. It's essentially a case where the "product" is artificially held in high demand - there is no substitute.

All other countries recognize that and ensure their population gets the health care they need by having a system where the government plays a role at least in the basic health care that every citizen is known to need. That dodges the above problem with capitalism. Then, many allow individuals to buy insurance from private corporations to cover stuff not seen as a requirement for all.

We, on the other hand, allow insurance companies to work to make a profit from every health care event required by our population, and those who can't afford the product are simply left without care - even in many cases where the absence of health care will lead to death.

So, we pay more and we serve fewer.

 

Proof? Come on give me some verification other than a chain email or an AstroTurf blog

 

single payer is very very very bad because govt is the single payer. Under Republican capitalism each customer pays and thus makes sure he gets value for what he pays and thus causes providers to compete for his business on basis of price and quality. Make sense?

 

okay got myself together nope no good need another laugh right, let me see how to respond to a conspiracy theory?

Don't know if I can actually because I think I will just hit confirmation bias

But for those with an open mind I live in a country with universal health care and private health for those who want it. If I want a toe nail cleaned or cosmetic surgery I will go private. If I had anything accute I will go public[/QUOTE]

t

No we pay. But we gain with a better overall system and a better overall standard of health for the community This makes the society more productive

Again the boogie man of rationing care. Tell me will your insurance pay for unlimited interventions for unlimited time?

Will you be allowed to have multiple organ transplants at age 98?

Will you be placed on an artificial heart and kidney machine in ICU for 3 years at a cost of 8,000 a day indefinitely?

Will premature babies 20 weeks old be put on ventilators even though they will not survive and will only suffer?

I agree that we have some rationing the case of "Baby k". Would not happen here or elsewhere.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baby_K

 

of course if true we'd switch to it in all industries!! Obviously socialism does not work!! Ever heard of Cuba/Florida or East /West Germany?? It is astounding what the liberal does not know.