What penalty should a woman who has an abortion face?

Absolutely. I understand that a woman who is pregnant faces a dire decision but just because you can't see the baby doesn't mean that it isn't human. Fetuses physically try to avoid the needle during the process and fight back during the abortion.

You hit the nail on the head when you mentioned adoption. That is the solution I see here and I do have experience on the subject. My first cousin in my family was born out of a teenage pregnancy in the early 1970s. Not only were the parents teenagers but the father had to go to Vietnam. The child was put up for adoption. In her late 20s she was reunited with her family. She now has a family of 11 children and has been reunited with her birth family. Doesn't she have a right live?

 

What "name" did I call you?
What about my post was "uncivilized"?
How exactly was I disrespectful?

 

The case you described turned out OK, but unfortunately that does not always happen as you may know.
Do you really think it is OK to force any woman to endure pregnancy and birth if she is set against it? If the fetus cannot live outside the host body and the woman doesn't want it how can you deny her the right to live as she chooses? By enforcing pregnancy you are treating her like a brood animal.

 

It was not enforced pregnancy because she chose to have sex. Therefore, abortion should be allowed in the case of rape, incest, health of the Mother. What if there is a grown adult who the woman doesn't like? What if she gave birth to a child and the child is causing too many problems with her life? Does she have the "choice" to kill that child?

 

Choosing to have sex and choosing whether or not to be pregnant are 2 different things. Having sex does not automatically mean accepting pregnancy. If it did you guys would be out of luck.

Of course you do not kill an already born human.

 

The arrogant comment was uncalled for since in no way did I say my opinion was absolute.

But you caught me on a bad day and my comments were more out of line. I apologize to you and the others participating in this debate. Emotionally charged topics can at times convince us to type things before we really think about them, especially when under stresses of real life.

 

Whilst I do sympathize and understand the views of pro-lifers as abortion is one of the few social issues I personally feel is not clear cut I do not think there should be any punishment for a woman who has an abortion.

 

What a fetus feels or doesn't feel is irrelevant...they are mostly aborted before the age they can feel pain.

A human fetus is human, it is not A human, it is not a person.

Adoption sounds so easy peasy to someone who isn't pregnant.


Pregnancy and giving birth mean 9 months of the woman's time, temporary and permanent physical damage including risk of death, pain and much discomfort including giving birth, financial loss, possible job loss, set backs in education and career....all to hand the kid to someone else !? And then maybe have it show up 20 years later with it's hand out?

That's stupid.

 

Abortion sounds so easy to someone who isn't a fetus and yes, a fetus is a human and does feel pain. Do you believe that avoiding the pains that a woman goes through in pregnancy is worth the loss of the life of an individual before that life has even been lived?

- - - Updated - - -

Every time you have sex, you should do so with the understanding that you may get pregnant. Every time you have sex you run that risk. What difference is there between killing a fetus and an already born human? Just the fact that you can't see it?

 

Pregnancy and child birth sounds so easy to someone who will never have to face it.

A fetus is NOT A human. It is not a person.



IF it was it would not have super rights over it's host or anyone else. NO one is allowed to use another body to sustain their life. Everyone has a right to protect themselves through self defense....even pregnant women.



You: "Do you believe that avoiding the pains that a woman goes through in pregnancy is worth the loss of the life of an individual before that life has even been lived?"""


That is completely and only up to the pregnant woman to decide....NO one should be able to decide for her. NO one else risks what she does, NO one else will experience her pain so NO one else should have control over what she does.


You: """Every time you have sex you run that risk"""

Just because you take a risk your rights shouldn't be taken away........if you risk mountain climbing and get hurt you STILL have the right to medical attention, you're not forced to die on the mountain because you took a risk.

You: """What difference is there between killing a fetus and an already born human?"""

A fetus is a fetus and a born person is a person.... a fetus is not a person.

 

A fetus is absolutely a person and like it or not a women womb sustains life and she does not have the option to end someone else's life without consequences. The issue of whether or not someone lives is up to the person living. Not someone else.

You: "You should not be for forced to die." I like your way of thinking!

How dare you say a fetus is not a person! That proves that your position is not based on sympathy. It is based on selfishness.

 

By law a fetus is not a person.....law, not feeeeeeeelings, emotions or what someone thinks is selfish. (BTW, I think people who have kids without asking the kids if they want to be born are VERY SELFISH)

A fetus is NOT A human. It is not a person.



IF it was it would not have super rights over it's host or anyone else. NO one is allowed to use another body to sustain their life. Everyone has a right to protect themselves through self defense....even pregnant women.

Yes, women DO have the option to end the life of the fetus....it's legal, there are no consequences.

 

So how about the man - shouldn't he think that he may cause pregnancy?

Like I said - if pregnancy was a condition for having sex you guys would be sooooo out of luck. How do you like THAT!?

Or....how about you sign a consent form that says if this results in pregnancy that you pledge 50% of your income to support it? This would be a legal document that would be filed with the court and resultant failure to comply would put you in jail for 19 years. That would include the time of pregnancy and the 18 years while the child grows up.

If you don't know the difference between killing an already born human and aborting a partially developed fetus - you are truly lost.
How about you go to these clinics and tell them that you will adopt all the aborted fetuses? If you did, you would be declared insane.

 

I think your consent form idea is an excellent idea. Yes, a man should be required to take care of a child if he took part in the creation of the child.

Every day people ask to adopt unborn fetuses, so as soon as the baby is born it will go to the adoptive family.

As for the other quote which I will not quote here, If a child is not human, then why does it fight the abortion process and avoid the needle? That means it has thoughts and feelings. It may be legal but it is not right. So I am alive, I was not killed, does that mean that I am a super human with rights overs someone else? If you are in another persons womb, you are allowed to use another body to sustain your life, same with people who have had liver transplants.

You are advocating the killing of an innocent person. I am confident your argument will go nowhere.

 

Why should a woman with "an abortion face" be penalised? It doesn't sound very pleasant in the first place.

 

Anyone read the book The Scarlet Letter ?

 

The maximal-statist fanatics who crave politicians seizing control of wombs and delight in the State's inflicting harsh punishment on the woman who dares to demonstrate dominion over her own body should be required to identify the victim.

If it is a mindless, microscopic gob of human cells, their bloodlust and zeal for government domination is readily dismissed.

To the extent that it is a matter of personal faith, folks should follow their own beliefs and not demand that politicians force some folks' notions upon everyone.

After the gestative process has resulted in the development of an actual person, of course, society then has a legitimate interest.


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You are not listening to any of my points. You are not criticizing what I am saying but how I am saying it, so I will stop debating with you but I have to respond to this here.

No, that is not true, The heart of the baby starts beating at three weeks. Before the Mother even knows she's pregnant. That is why in Texas they passed a sonogram law. The woman has to see what she is killing and that is alive to have an abortion.

 

Punish her for getting rid of an unwanted microscopic gob of mindless cells? How primitive of them.

 

The truth is that this is what your human embryo looks like at three weeks under a microscope:

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It has no brain. It is about the size of a poppy seed.

Poppy seed (the size of a human embryo at four weeks) with a US quarter dollar for comparison::

​

 

Texas is quite backwards if it thinks women don't know what "pregnant" means.

 

Tar and feathering.