What Russia's deadliest nuclear sub could do to the US

Wouldn't know. My father left Northrop in the late-1950s and came back in the 1960s.

A lot of projects he worked on were secret, so he wouldn't have been talking about them. I suspect you know the drill--you just don't talk to anyone about secret things you're involved with.

 

scratch

 

Did the USSR/Russia lose in Afghanistan?

 

This is a dreadful attempt and claiming a sort of victory from an utter defeat.

1). Whatever firepower Vietnam might have got from abroad has nothing to do with surviving the bombings. How many B-52's did the Vietnamese shoot down? And no matter how you slice it Vietnam won the war not by firepower but by guts. They fought tenaciously when the odds were way against them. Did they win by some offence that left them the last man standing? No. Did huge swarms of tanks roll into the Americans? No. Did they bomb the bejesus out of regiments of Yankees? No. Only God knows how many of them died for every one American. Firepower is hardly worth mentioning. For the Vietnamese firepower was a mere diversion.

2). "Won in the South"? What are you talking about? The NLF got stronger by the day and they were instrumental in defeating the U.S. What are you talking about "won in the south"? Please explain yourself.

3). "Did not lose"? "Negotiated your way out"? I am sorry, but this is poppycock logic. I mean truly silly. "South Vietnam lost that war"? There was no "South Vietnam" in the first place. The U.S. created a war where none existed. You really do not know much about Vietnam. You really do not know how the U.S. came to be in Vietnam. You really do not know what roll the U.S. was supposed to play in Vietnam. You really do not know how the U.S. prevented Vietnam to carry out its Democratic elections.

Sorry to say it but you have nothing of any value or insight into the Vietnam war because you actually know nothing at all about it.

 

I think it was 31 B-52s that were shot down in the Vietnam War. Out of hundreds of missions. B-52s shot down three Migs with their guns.

By the way "Migs" were Soviet built fighters. North Vietnam had hundreds of them in service during the Vietnam War.

And the 1968 Tet Offensive basically ended up with the Vietcong guerrillas in South Vietnam destroyed. The rest of the world was fought by North Vietnamese regulars.

And a "democratic election" that results in communists or communist allied people winning is not a democratic election.

Democracy is much more than "one man, one vote, once"

 

Read my lips and pay attention: There was no North Vietnam and South Vietnam. It was one country separated by American manipulation. My God, this is common knowledge.

"Good will"? OMG. Your national propaganda has you held hostage to this very day. Read my lips and pay attention: The U.S. was HELPING no one. The U.S. destroyed Vietnam's fledgeling Democracy and inserted its American tax + war machine business + politics = money in the pockets of the American warmongers. That is the ONLY reason the U.S. occupied the country.

 

If it is common knowledge prove it. And NOT from some left wing anti war source.

 

Handful my buttocks. I know there were swarms of them in the Central Highlands alone, including self-propelled howitzers.

Tank battles? You think tanks are only deployed in the face of tanks from "the other guys"? You're thinking Hollywood.

Now, this is really funny! FIRST: Most of what the Vietnamese got from Russia or China was surplus so don't make it seem that the "best before date" on B-52's is relevant. We captured all kinds of rusty outdated weapons, some of which couldn't fire rounds from one weapon to the next one. They made do the best they could. SECOND: The Vietnamese had no B-52's or anything like it. So what are you trying to say, if anything?

You are making a delusional mistake in thinking my wisdom is irrelevant. Yes that's right, I correctly used the word "wisdom".

 

Self propelled howitzers are NOT tanks. If you don't know that (which is obvious) then anything else you claim is completely suspect.

 

The people living in the South wanted no part of the communist form of government. Why would you rank those of the north above those of the South? America never caused the problems of Vietnam. My god, i served in our Army in Germany prior to this war getting very far along. Fact is when
I got back from the Army in Jan 1964, Americans paid no attention to vietnam other than our special forces there to coach the people of the South.

Look, I will treat you as you treat me. I do not enjoy posters who believe they are superior beings.

Actually it was the desire of Franklin Roosevelt we help Vietnam. We were not there to cause a war, but to try to end a skirmish. Please do not pretend the South wanted communism.

Harry Truman took over the role that had been held by Roosevelt and he actually started helping the South for the first time. Yep, you will learn this should you go to his presidents library in Missouri.

There was nothing at all about Ho Chi Minh that would cause him to be the leader over all of Vietnam.

 

My understanding gained from my books on Vietnam tell me that tanks were not very useful in that country other than in a few parts of it.

 

Oh, you really crack me up. Where do you get these silly ideas? Really, where did you read that?

So you out-and-out admit you are a Fascist sympathizer. You seriously know nothing about Vietnam - about the French occupation - about its hard-won liberation from colonization - about how and by whom that victory was achieved - and who the Vietnamese people considered their saviour. AND MOST IMPORTANT who would have won the election AND WHY.

Denying the Vietnamese people their Democratic right to vote is a Fascist crime .... and you support it. Nice going, Dayton. All of your cards are on the table now.

 

Pick up any history book on Vietnam. And NOT from some right wing pro war source.

 

You bleed Democratic party.

I have no idea of your age but I served in the American army prior to Lyndon Baines Johnson jerking us into that war with a combat role. When I served in the Army our forces were directed to coach the South forces and assist but try not to lead the war. Our mission used very few Americans. LBJ turned it into the mess it became.

Why are you so damned confrontational? What do you gain by trying to jack yourself up to the point you come across as if you think you are GOD?

I am not posting on this topic, nor any topic to try to outgun other posters nor shame them.

I know a hell of a lot more about that war than you think i know.

Why do you insist we lost the war? While we did not win it, we never lost it. The North defeated forces of the South. We had been gone for 2 years.

We had the same path to victory that Ike had in WW2. We were not against a better military. We were going against an inferior military. Johnson so poisoned the war that Nixon was caught with almost no way to fight it correct. But trust me, had we invaded the North the game was over for Ho Chi Minh.

My own company commander in Germany was a bit after I departed Germany shipped to command in Vietnam. Funny he never talked to me as you talk to me and Dayton. He and i served under General William DePuy who commanded in Vietnam. I will say this about DePuy. Had that war been turned over to him totally, he would never be accused of losing any war. DePuy was one hell of a top commanding General. He was unfortunately not the top General of Vietnam for American forces so had to deal with a General with one more star.

Presidents of the USA made choices that were dumb choices.

my guess is you have no clue who General William Depuy was.

 

Try the World Book Encyclopedia.

 

I guess the word "including" is not in your dictionary? Take another look. You'll find it in the pages marked with the letter "I".

 

The Encyclopedia is a "pro war" source?

 

Self propelled howitzers are not "included" as tanks. Once again give you apparently do not know that anything you claim regarding knowledge of the Vietnam War suspect.


Apparently you learned all your history knowledge from left wing loons like Noam Chomsky and Paul Krugman.

 

If you had any wisdom about this subject it would be irrelevant. You don't so its not.

Are you a life long resident of Sweden? If so that probably explains much.

 

You act like this is some damned fist fight. Calm down. We both know much more about that war than you credit us for. Trust me, you can no doubt educate me on Bonsai Trees but you are not my superior on the Vietnam war. I doubt you are Dayton's either.

Even those who do not get the part about the French do not need to know that to deal with the US role when we went combat all in under president Johnson. We only need to know what we did. The French got ran out. Some claim Nixon got ran out but he and the north came to an agreement and the North 2 years after broke the agreement.

I have talked to a lot of Vietnamese who fought in that war and those that lived there during the war. They did not welcome the communist. They wanted no part of the Ho Chi Minh regime.

You make it sound as if the citizens living in the South were wrong and they should embrace communism. They were too sharp of mind to want to embrace communism.

 

Self Propelled howitzers are not constructed to be tanks. They are a self propelled artillery weapon.

 

And who do you think the ranks of the NLF were made up of, Martians?

As I have just explained there was no North and South. Do you think only half of the country won its war against the French occupation?

Vietnam had no problem until the U.S. stopped the Democratic election. Why is this so difficult for you to understand? Do you know what democracy means? Are you sure?

Well, my god too. I served in the Central Highlands of Vietnam. So what does Germany have to do with anything at all on the subject of Vietnam? Hmmmmm?

Oh, I see. You want to have the floor and for me to be silent. You think that your duty in Germany trumps my duty in Vietnam ...... on the discussion of Vietnam. Well, ain't that a kick in the teeth.

What are you saying? Democracy would cause him to be the leader of Vietnam. The man was a hero to the Vietnamese people! The U.S. didn't rush in to save Vietnam from a Fascist ... they rushed in to prevent the Democratic election from taking place. In other words, the U.S. acted as an anti-Democracy Fascist.

 

How many subs has Russia lost?

 

But you don't know as much as I do. In fact, what you have contributed so far is pretty much verbatim American misinformation, disinformation, and propaganda. You don't actually "know" anything as far as I can see of what you've said so far. Maybe you're just getting warmed up to reveal some insight that you've been holding in reserve?