Why do Zionist apologists demand special debating privileges?

Whatever I post is negated exactly like the Arabs do... Don't you know we have been accused to have performed 9/11? That we control America and that we have never beaten the Arab armies five times... Now I suspect you are a Muslim Myth Maker.

 

Whatever I post is negated exactly like the Arabs do... Don't you know we have been accused to have performed 9/11? That we control America and that we have never beaten the Arab armies five times... Now I suspect you are a Muslim Myth Maker.

 

A Zionist supporter posted the OP (in the ME section) for a thread entitled "Twenty facts about Israel and the ME". It was fraught with inaccuracies and stale Myths, many of them recently dedunked (with references) on the Political Forum. I responded out pointed out the conflicts with the real historical record, concluding with the comments contained in the Klipkap post below.

Take a look at the response if you want to see a wonderful case of Strawman debating and non-response. And I am convinced that the author thinks that he did an astounding job of thrashing a Jew-hating anti-semitic racist like me [:sarcasm:]

 

You just can't fix stupid and so many of them. Go bull, go!



Look at Spain biggest national achievment and don't ask why the country is in such a deep sh&&&&it...





http://www.youtube.com/embed/2h-WhhqFjv4?feature=player_detailpage

 

And leave poor Germany out of it, too. Israel likes to bum free stuff off of everyone it can.

 

Funny you ask... Germany volunteers because of their DIRTY CONSCIENCE.

 

All your myths are based on one sissy 'Chister' from the UK... Shut up already!

I still wonder what motivate you to carry on... Maybe you were gored by a lose bull in the wrong place and fell on your head somewhere.

 

Regarding the OP .... Need I say more?

HBendor, On the source of factual information on the topic of the ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians, surely you know that Benny Morris, Shlomo Ben-Ami, Yitzhak Rabin, Tom Segev, Nur Masalha, Menachem Begin, Ari Shavit, Walid Khalidi, Nadav Safran, Efraim Karsh, and Avi Shlaim, amongst many others, were not born in England!!

Tsk tsk tsk

 

....

 

I know, Marlowe; I know.
Mindless trash (paid for by the hour?) replying utterly in the face of the evidence provided --- in fact SUPPORTING it.

Here is another example where trash debating is offered and then VICTORY claimed:

 

The proof of the pudding is in the eating Benny Morris has recanted...

Shlomo Ben Ami was a friend of mine... we used to speak at leat once a day.
Yitzhak Rabin was the Murderer of the Altalena sailors wading a shore.
Tom Segev is a nice fellow.
Nur Masalha is an Arab
Menahem Begin is the best man I ever met, the most knowledgeable of the whole lot and I doubt he wrote anything negative.
Ari Shavit, Walid Khalidi, Avi Shlain are not to rely on and on their writings.
Nadav Safran is excellent.

There is a Bull run in your neighborhood Pamplona... please go visit.

 

The proof of the pudding is in the eating Benny Morris has recanted...

Shlomo Ben Ami was a friend of mine... we used to speak at leat once a day.
Yitzhak Rabin was the Murderer of the Altalena sailors wading a shore.
Tom Segev is a nice fellow.
Nur Masalha is an Arab
Menahem Begin is the best man I ever met, the most knowledgeable of the whole lot and I doubt he wrote anything negative.
Ari Shavit, Walid Khalidi, Avi Shlain are not to rely on and on their writings.
Nadav Safran is excellent.

There is a Bull run in your the neighborhood of Pamplona... please go visit.

 

Yes , its well known , but what is NOT yet known was the amount of pressure put on him which forced him to eat humble pie and partially withdraw his earlier findings allowing him to regain acceptance amongst Zionists and keep his job.

On the other side Illan Pappe is a man of stronger principles and refused to recent.

[video=youtube;sIWvcBzbqVc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIWvcBzbqVc&feature=related[/video]



Bender , let's see whether you've got what it takes to listen to Illan Pappe ?

..
...

 

If you are waiting for a factual rebuttal off zionist fools you will be waiting forever as none of them deal in anything factual at all. Now either they are the dumbest people on the planet or they just like to lie on the Internet,take your pick. There is a 3rd option,they hate Arabs and love to see them getting murdered and their land stolen.

 

I do not have to listen to an Israeli born 'turn coat'... He is from Haifa and I am from Jerusalem... like any country in the world the US Has its own Benedict Arnolds, the UK British Sergeant Harold Cole and Israel has it own deficient Josephus Flavius = Yosef Ben Mattatiahu... Imagine someone like Pappe writing the truth about his country of birth.

 

People who support Israel lie all the time as shown all over the Internet. It goes something like this lie..get turned over by someone who knows the facts..wait a bit then repeat lie.

 

Ya know all of these back and forths about whether the arabs left or were ethnically cleansed is really no longer relevant.

It is not longer relevant in the grand scheme of things.

The palestinians have always look to the past and the percieved injustices perpetrated on them, without the faintest acknowledgement of the war that was fought and they and their arab allies lost.

When will the palestinians stop looking backwards to past injustices (as valid as they may be) and start looking forward to fulfilling their national aspirations?
They cannot eradicate Israel. they cannot actually believe that Israel would let the survivors of 48 and their gazillion offspring to return to Israel proper.

So, how about pulling their heads out of their arses and start planning on how they can achieve their nationist dreams. How about them considering what sacrifices and compromises are worth attain nationhood. How about actually stop focussing on the "enemy" and start focussing on their own good governance.

Its pretty (*)(*)(*)(*) stupid to constantly look inthe rear view mirror. History isn't going to change. Perceived injustice due to war isn't going to be rectified.

why don't the palestinians and all of their supporters start implementing meaningful, objective, rational and doable strategies to achieve nationhood?

Instead it seems that the palestinians are proof positive of Einsteins definition of insanity.

 

I would be interested in how you see them achieving this.

 

I agree with most of what you wrote above, but I object to two items:

a) The Palestinians can obviously never forget their own ethnic cleansing by the Zionists. So to deny this great disaster is to them like holocaust denial. However, they no longer propose turning back 1948 as a viable option. One only needs to look at the PLO's 1988 manifesto. Of course I do understand that that milestone has been allowed to fade into oblivion in the Western media. So 1948 still has great relevance, in that it is a huge part of their collective nationalist baggage, and that baggage has to be also put on the weighing scales of who has been done what injustices in the southern Levant and how much more that camel's back can be expected to stand.

b) The sentence highlighted in your post above makes me a bit sad. I say that because it shows just how unaware the West is of the Arab peace offers, starting from the early 1970s. One of the most important of these was made in 2002 right in the guts of the Second Intifada. Given its timing and its content I would have thought that at least a small echo would have lingered on today, especially since it was remade in 2007. In terms of this post, the most important part of that 2002 Arab offer made at the Beirut Summit of the Arab League (click the blue for a source) was the following:

 

you know the routine too I see

 

THE MOST CONTENTIOUS, DISINGENUOUS POST EVER Peace with PRECONDITIONS...



2. Further calls upon Israel to affirm:

I- Full Israeli withdrawal from all the territories occupied since 1967, including the Syrian Golan Heights, to the June 4, 1967 lines as well as the remaining occupied Lebanese territories in the south of Lebanon.

II- Achievement of a just solution to the Palestinian refugee problem to be agreed upon in accordance with U.N. General Assembly Resolution 194.

III- The acceptance of the establishment of a sovereign independent Palestinian state on the Palestinian territories occupied since June 4, 1967 in the West Bank and Gaza Strip, with East Jerusalem as its capital.

3. Consequently, the Arab countries affirm the following:

I- Consider the Arab-Israeli conflict ended, and enter into a peace agreement with Israel, and provide security for all the states of the region.

II- Establish normal relations with Israel in the context of this comprehensive peace.

4. Assures the rejection of all forms of Palestinian patriation which conflict with the special circumstances of the Arab host countries.

5. Calls upon the government of Israel and all Israelis to accept this initiative in order to safeguard the prospects for peace and stop the further shedding of blood, enabling the Arab countries and Israel to live in peace and good neighbourliness and provide future generations with security, stability and prosperity.

6. Invites the international community and all countries and organisations to support this initiative.

7. Requests the chairman of the summit to form a special committee composed of some of its concerned member states and the secretary general of the League of Arab States to pursue the necessary contacts to gain support for this initiative at all levels, particularly from the United Nations, the Security Council, the United States of America, the Russian Federation, the Muslim states and the European Union.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

For purposes of comparison, the following is an earlier draft discussed by Arab foreign ministers on 25 March, 2002, in advance of the summit:

The Council of the Arab League, which convenes at the level of a summit on March 27-28, 2002 in Beirut, affirms the Arab position that achieving just and comprehensive peace is a strategic choice and goal for the Arab states.

After the Council heard the statement of Crown Prince Abdullah bin Abdul Aziz in which he called for the establishment of normal relations in the context of a comprehensive peace with Israel, and that Israel declares its readiness to withdraw from the occupied Arab territories in compliance with United Nations resolutions 242 and 338 and Security Council resolution 1397, enhanced by the Madrid conference and the land-for-peace principle, and the acceptance of an independent, sovereign Palestinian state with al-Quds al-Sharif as its capital, the Council calls on the Israeli government to review its policy and to resort to peace while declaring that just peace is its strategic option.

The Council also calls on Israel to assert the following:

Complete withdrawal from the Arab territories occupied since 1967, including full withdrawal from the occupied Syrian Golan Heights and the remaining occupied parts of south Lebanon to the June 4, 1967 lines.

To accept to find an agreed, just solution to the problem of Palestinian refugees in conformity with Resolution 194.

To accept an independent and sovereign Palestinian state on the Palestinian lands occupied since June 4, 1967 in the West Bank and Gaza Strip and with Jerusalem (al-Quds al-Sharif) as its capital in accordance with Security Council Resolution 1397.

In return, the Arab states assert the following:

To consider the Arab-Israeli conflict over and to enter into a peace treaty with Israel to consolidate this.

To achieve comprehensive peace for all the states of the region.

To establish normal relations within the context of comprehensive peace with Israel.

The Council calls on the Israeli government and the Israelis as a whole to accept this initiative to protect the prospects of peace and to spare bloodshed so as to enable the Arab states and Israel to coexist side by side and to provide for the coming generations a secure, stable and prosperous future.

It calls on the international community with all its organisations and states to support the initiative.

The Council calls on its presidency, its secretary general and its follow-up committee to follow up on the special contacts related to this initiative and to support it on all levels, including the United Nations, the United States, Russia, the European Union and the Security Council.

 

THE MOST CONTENTIOUS, DISINGENUOUS POST EVER Peace with PRECONDITIONS...



2. Further calls upon Israel to affirm:

I- Full Israeli withdrawal from all the territories occupied since 1967, including the Syrian Golan Heights, to the June 4, 1967 lines as well as the remaining occupied Lebanese territories in the south of Lebanon.

II- Achievement of a just solution to the Palestinian refugee problem to be agreed upon in accordance with U.N. General Assembly Resolution 194.

III- The acceptance of the establishment of a sovereign independent Palestinian state on the Palestinian territories occupied since June 4, 1967 in the West Bank and Gaza Strip, with East Jerusalem as its capital.

3. Consequently, the Arab countries affirm the following:

I- Consider the Arab-Israeli conflict ended, and enter into a peace agreement with Israel, and provide security for all the states of the region.

II- Establish normal relations with Israel in the context of this comprehensive peace.

4. Assures the rejection of all forms of Palestinian patriation which conflict with the special circumstances of the Arab host countries.

5. Calls upon the government of Israel and all Israelis to accept this initiative in order to safeguard the prospects for peace and stop the further shedding of blood, enabling the Arab countries and Israel to live in peace and good neighbourliness and provide future generations with security, stability and prosperity.

6. Invites the international community and all countries and organisations to support this initiative.

7. Requests the chairman of the summit to form a special committee composed of some of its concerned member states and the secretary general of the League of Arab States to pursue the necessary contacts to gain support for this initiative at all levels, particularly from the United Nations, the Security Council, the United States of America, the Russian Federation, the Muslim states and the European Union.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

For purposes of comparison, the following is an earlier draft discussed by Arab foreign ministers on 25 March, 2002, in advance of the summit:

The Council of the Arab League, which convenes at the level of a summit on March 27-28, 2002 in Beirut, affirms the Arab position that achieving just and comprehensive peace is a strategic choice and goal for the Arab states.

After the Council heard the statement of Crown Prince Abdullah bin Abdul Aziz in which he called for the establishment of normal relations in the context of a comprehensive peace with Israel, and that Israel declares its readiness to withdraw from the occupied Arab territories in compliance with United Nations resolutions 242 and 338 and Security Council resolution 1397, enhanced by the Madrid conference and the land-for-peace principle, and the acceptance of an independent, sovereign Palestinian state with al-Quds al-Sharif as its capital, the Council calls on the Israeli government to review its policy and to resort to peace while declaring that just peace is its strategic option.

The Council also calls on Israel to assert the following:

Complete withdrawal from the Arab territories occupied since 1967, including full withdrawal from the occupied Syrian Golan Heights and the remaining occupied parts of south Lebanon to the June 4, 1967 lines.

To accept to find an agreed, just solution to the problem of Palestinian refugees in conformity with Resolution 194.

To accept an independent and sovereign Palestinian state on the Palestinian lands occupied since June 4, 1967 in the West Bank and Gaza Strip and with Jerusalem (al-Quds al-Sharif) as its capital in accordance with Security Council Resolution 1397.

In return, the Arab states assert the following:

To consider the Arab-Israeli conflict over and to enter into a peace treaty with Israel to consolidate this.

To achieve comprehensive peace for all the states of the region.

To establish normal relations within the context of comprehensive peace with Israel.

The Council calls on the Israeli government and the Israelis as a whole to accept this initiative to protect the prospects of peace and to spare bloodshed so as to enable the Arab states and Israel to coexist side by side and to provide for the coming generations a secure, stable and prosperous future.

It calls on the international community with all its organisations and states to support the initiative.

The Council calls on its presidency, its secretary general and its follow-up committee to follow up on the special contacts related to this initiative and to support it on all levels, including the United Nations, the United States, Russia, the European Union and the Security Council.

 

Go there and read why Lebanon was attacked by Sharon...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1982_Lebanon_War#Background

There was no reason to attack Lebanon, my left foot...
When you do not have anything to write you seem to invent history to suit your nefarious wishes.

 

Go there and read why Lebanon was attacked by Sharon...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1982_Lebanon_War#Background

There was no reason to attack Lebanon, my left foot...
When you do not have anything to write you seem to invent history to suit your nefarious wishes.

 

On the topic of the OP, the following post gets the prize for being the most astonishing Strawman so far in 2012.

It is meant to be a rebuttal of the fact that nowhere do the words of the Mandate for Palestine cater for the creation of a Jewish State or Country, and that this was emphasised to be so by Churchill himself. [see the Klipkap reference]

Read it and marvel.

I doubt that this will be beaten in the short term as the crowning case of "special debating privileges" being required by a Zionist Apologist.