There is no right to have an abortion

I have concerns about using viability as the guideline.

If the fetus is not developed enough to be viable, a woman can get an abortion because the fetus could not possibly survive.
If the fetus is developed enough to be viable, a woman should be able to have the fetus removed because these theoretical parents waiting to adopt could accept the fetus at that point, incubate it (maybe pro-life groups would help them pay the medical expenses for that procedure) and soon have the newborn they have been waiting to adopt. Personally I do not believe many pro-life groups would be interested in accepting the burden that they so freely demand that pregnant women bear.

How would you consider viability being used as the guideline?

 

And therefore you are pro choice. Not your family, not your decision is precisely what pro choice means.

 

Not at all true. Your mouth overloads your brain when you try to tell the forum what my beliefs are.

Just last evening on the TV program 20/20, a victim of rape was asked how she feel about her child and how the rapist feels about the child and she smiled and proclaimed the child is very loved by her and the rapist.

It is easy to wonder how she feels like that but she clearly does.

This is one victim of rape that also spoke to 20/20

Oh well, could not grab her photo on this system so this link takes you there.

http://abcnews.go.com/2020/photos/a...rown-women-speak-2020-13300286/image-13300342

 

How did you conclude that since I never stated that?

All i am saying is that while I don't make her decisions, I never made the decision to drown children that Susan Smith made either yet I would not tell you pro choice gave her said choice to drown her children.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crime/20-years-killing-sons-susan-smith-no-monster-article-1.2300581

 

Quote Originally Posted by FoxHastings View Post

LOL!....Another Anti-Choicer who thinks contraception is ALL a woman's responsibility, who doesn't think men have any responsibility... but then wants to force her to give birth."""



HOW does your blaming women for YOU not using contraception have anything to do with rapists???????????????????


Nice dodge

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No, "Pro-Choice" does not, and did not, give any woman the right to kill children.... you are losing it

The discussion is abortion, not murder. Try not to get so flustered that you forget the topic....or tell an "untruth" about it....

 

I notice how the left wingers keep clinging to the word fetus as if that makes killing children okay, so to mask this, they persist on saying fetus.

When women get pregnant, you don't hear them talking like and the reason why is that the so called fetus is their child.

"Honey, I am pregnant with our desired child" or Boyfriend, I am pregnant and of course she is pregnant but with a horse or a child? Every one of us was a fetus. What are we today?

Babies go through stages but from conception to birth and following we were humans. We were not some sort of other creature. Why minimize the death of a child by saying Fetus?

Medically it is a Fetus. But do you see doctors alleging this "fetus" is not human nor a child?

The left wingers adore acting as if they suddenly are medical experts and cling to a word like that just to make you think the baby should die.

Why have children at all? All children were once called a Fetus. That does not excuse this country's massive destruction of human beings.

 

Fox Hastings, you will never bully me to your satisfaction.

Give it up. Won't work on me. See how the poster spoke to me going by the name Random Observer. That man has it together.

 

I did not see 20/20 last night, but based on the information here I would say this is a good example to illustrate that the government should NEVER try to override a woman's choice. It would not be unreasonable for an "official government policy" to consider the statistics and dictate that EVERY woman who is impregnated during a rape MUST have an abortion. Pro-choice policy would say the pregnant woman is the one who understands her own mind, health, and resources better than any other human being, so she is the one who should decide whether to have an abortion or have a baby.

 

We are all forced by government to do many things. This country should be completely free. A few examples are we must get fishing licenses. The government does not help us catch fish. We get no fishing instructions due to paying for a license. We get no help of any sort. We pay for hunting licenses. Again no help on the game or ways to make good use of the license. We get told to pay for a drivers license, then you license your car, then the government mandates you pay some commerce firm called an insurance company for their product, to wit: the insurance they sell.

We are told April 15 is the day certain we must pay our income taxes short of the Feds changing that date for a holiday purpose.

To do my job, I had to qualify for and pay for state license. To get qualified, I have attended so many hours of education that you might be amazed. Since being a broker, I have spent over 400 hours in school just to keep the license.

But you might think this was good enough. Then once Obama signed a law, I found that the state license was no longer good enough despite actual experience in the loan business plus schooling in finance. Some courses are not in college but the state or Feds must approve the course.

I am telling you that the only thing stopping a woman from aborting her children is that strong laws must be in force or she will have abortions.

This to me is not about her freedom. She conceived. She knew sex is how to get pregnant. This is like driving a car at 100 miles an hour then trying to tell us that the person had no idea an accident could happen.

Most of the unwanted pregnancies were not as much a surprise as you may think.

She was aware at all times that having sex is how one makes a child.

Sure, the guy also knows but in his case he never carries the child. She by operation of nature must be far more diligent to protect herself than the man can be. The man may or may not want to wear condoms. Some of you act as if those are wonderful. But they are terrible.

The sure way for a man to not produce children is a vasectomy. Yes, this writer did get one.

Most supporting abortion do not understand how women think. Some callous women think the child is a nuisance so she is happy to abort. It costs but better than having the child in her mind.

The men don't get off scott free.

They will be blamed for her getting pregnant. She will almost always put all the blame on the male.

She won't take responsibility other than for getting the abortion.

A good way to bust up a relationship is for her to get an abortion and have to look at the man she blames for her getting pregnant. In her mind, all of it is his fault. Maybe she told him she wants no kids. Still the jerk got her pregnant. So she bails out.

Maybe the so called pro choice people see women as all over and easy to obtain. But the men will get blamed.

 

I'm glad things turned out ok for them, and that she had the CHOICE. She made a choice and it was right for her. Doesn't mean that choice is right for everyone else.

 

Are you saying every woman will abort children because women are just evil? The only thing that will stop abortions is keeping penises out of vaginas. That's the only thing. Something tells me some other men here might have an issue with that.

She didn't conceive. She had sex, was raped or whatever... But she didn't just conceive, there is another person involved. Pregnancy is one result from sex, and not the one most people have sex for. Are you saying people should just only have sex when they want a baby? Good luck with that. A more accurate analogy would be that the risk of pregnancy by having sex is like the risk of a car accident by driving. Do people stop driving because they might crash? No.

More terrible than abortions? I can't even handle how insane you sound.

 

Those on 20/20 never had choice. The rapists refused to allow them to leave the house for any help.

Look, think of the full implilcations.

Women abuse their children, Should women that abuse their child have the right to do that or kill the kid?

You are saying the women who have choice get to terminate the human life.

While it is not yet born, the life is human.

Why isn't human life important to Democrats or other fellow left wingers?

 

Why aren't rights and freedom and liberty important to you.....?

 

The baby is human. I believe it is entirely innocent. It was not guilty of impregnating the mother by the father.

Rights include the baby.

They are extremely important to me.

 

No, rights include born persons.


I can keep this up forever ...a fetus has no rights and certainly will never have EXTRA rights as you seem to think they should...

 

Wow. If that is the measure of success then the world is a sad place.

No. And they don't, it's illegal.

Women are human. Why isn't the life of the woman important to republicans? Does the baby have a right to kill its mother should she not survive pregnancy?

Pregnancy is a very unique situation where it is impossible to not infringe on someone's rights. The baby lives off the mother therefore her rights must be considered. Do I love abortion? No, but I cannot tell someone that the baby's rights must come before the mother's especially when it 1) depends on her body physically and 2) isn't born yet. In your line of thinking the woman's rights don't matter, only the baby's do. How is that any more righteous than the mother's rights coming before the baby's?

There is no easy solution with unplanned pregnancies whether they stemmed from consensual sex or rape. The ideal scenario is that people are well educated and have easy affordable access to birth control. That would really reduce abortions, but for some reason the right is against sex education and birth control. Go figure.

 

According to law, they have no rights until they are born. You know who else is human? Women. What about the woman's rights? Why do you suggest the baby's come before hers?

 

It was prior to my birth, but history tells us of people who had no rights either that today have them.

I don't mind you saying Fetus. Perhaps you have no children or if you do have them, you see them as something not human prior to birth. If this be true, are you human or is the mother human? Humans mate and produce humans.

I don't believe you to be the authority of rights.

Not for the unborn nor the born.

 

Nice dodge yet again. Are women human?

 

When blacks are discussed, we at some point discuss they had no rights. This is all associated for a rather odd reason to women. Women did have rights however for the married woman, she was assumed to be as one with her husband on voting for things.

Some cases where the woman may die due to carrying her child, doctors judge that the baby dies or she dies.

This special case tends to favor the woman. Few will argue for the life of her child over her life. She may have children in her home to take care of.

My reply is I do not see her baby's rights as being in front.

Women do kill the unborn by the millions. Surely all of those women are not in mortal danger.

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If you honestly do not know, or you are playing games, my reply is of course women are human.

Now, back to you. Is her baby human prior to birth?

 

Killing the unborn at any stage of the gestation period is the same in my view. If it is illegal to harm the born child, surely it is illegal to harm the child not yet born in my view at least.

What is suggested, nay, told to me by some of the left, the unborn don't matter one bit. FH blurts out that the unborn have zero rights. As if he alone decides on the fate of humans. Even he admits they are human, yet as the god of the unborn, declares they still have no rights.

Well, blacks once had no rights either.

 

I addressed the woman being killed by the gestation process. I stated, to remind you, that in the case of the woman being essentially killed by the baby, she has the right to her life and her life probably includes more children and or family. The baby has no such responsibility. This troubling case is generally handled to favor the mother unless she is on life support then the baby gets to survive, though she lost her life.

I agree that pregnancy poses serious problems. Who or what god decided the unborn lack rights?
And this country has a history of verdicts being turned over. Dred Scott was overturned. A number of court cases even in the SC were turned over by later courts.

I put the baby or unborn rights as equal to the mother.

I wish you quit claiming that the woman's rights don't matter to me. Her rights are extremely important to me.

My first wife had one. In her case, our family doctor warned us of her blood condition. She had Rh Negative and this can sure be very serious. Look, when this took place, I was a very devoted Democrat.

This is important to understand. I had a vastly different mindset as a loyal Democrat than i do as a republican.

While personal liberty is very important to me, both in women's cases but in mens, since to me all are equal, the baby is also equal and worth defending the baby's liberty.

As I said, if the baby is a definite life threat against the mother, her wishes should be given powerful weight, such as the case where she wants to die to save the baby, or live so the baby dies, that is not the normal case when women have abortions. Most are not in a bad condition to lose their lives.

I agree that we all should be properly educated.

The reason why a few of those on my side worry about sex education is it seems that this has led to a lot more women having abortions.

Few people having sex don't know the woman gets pregnant. Millions of people face this but know ways to not get pregnant.

Anyway, you and I agree it is a massive problem. Abortion kills. And in my opinion it is the very easy way out.

The procedure for the woman often is a process where her problem lasts but a day. She gets some medication to help with the discomfort and a day later is back on the job.

A good many parents see their children having sex as simply too soon. They would fare far better by waiting to become adults. Even adults make major errors. Divorce courts prove this.

A society that kills the unborn is far less sensitive to the human life. The society that approves abortion is leading this country down the path back to the olden days where clubbing your neighbor for some crime is okay.

As it now is, many Muslims don't mind meting out localized justice, even in front of cops. Cops may take pictures of a mob grabbing a woman over her supposedly burning a book and killing her coldly and ruthlessly.

I prefer America not go down that path. Abortion to me is similar to the Muslim honor killings.