Employers are fed up with college 'waste,' opt for skilled blue-collar workers instead

LOL! Can you integrate this differential equation without looking up the answer? If you don't know what calculus is, I doubt it.

 

you said it was an investment. In order for something to be an investment you put something into it and get more out of it.

Education can very much be an investment that you put time into it and you get out of it and a lot of cases the ability to earn more money or advance in a career.

so if it's not about money or a career what the hell do you need to go to college for if you can learn on own?

I understand the value of knowledge I just don't like it being gatekept to turn it into a scheme to make money.

no you changed it suggesting taxpayers should cover the cost.

see this is what a public education gets you. The government operates your schools so it gets to tell you that it's the hero and its own story.

The government didn't build the country, the people did. Government is a corrupting Force generally.

you think the government built the country I'm not sure I value what you think is excellent education. Sounds like brainwashing to me.

The government can't build anything all it can do is steal that's all it does. The people built the nation

Good, you should only borrow to do degree that will make it to where you earn enough to pay off your debt.

If you don't your education is an expense and it should be your expense not the taxpayers.

Just so you know the government has no money. It has no means of building wealth or anything for that matter. The only thing it has is the ability to take from people who build.

Get your head out of the public school crap it's rotting your brain

 

I have knowledge about my skills.

Can you diagnose cylinder 3 misfire on a 3406?

Speaking of jargon doesn't make me smarter than you it just means I've studied different things.

 

Nerds equation is an example of an everyday use of Calculus.

Calculus, branch of mathematics concerned with the calculation of instantaneous rates of change (differential calculus) and the summation of infinitely many small factors to determine some whole (integral calculus).

 

Fair enough but you didn't understand the point of the question.

Is that all there is to calculus or is it barely scratching the surface?

I never learned calculus outside of apparently compounding interest.

I've not encountered a problem in my life where I said dang if only I knew calculus.

That's not the same that I shouldn't learn it. Just to know. But I could learn much cheaper than through college.

 

You can invest in art and just enjoy it. You can invest in knowlege and derive pleasure from "knowing", it doesn't have to pay off financially. Though both of those examples can.

We've already discussed the benefit of learning from someone that is well versed in a subject.

Good for you.

No, you said student's should default on debt, I said they shouldn't be forced into debt.

No, there are many checks on the public education system.

No, on that we'll have to disagree.

And you sound like sour grapes to me.

No, the Glen Canyon Dam is extrodinarily impressive, and provides power, recreation and irrigation across the South West.

In your humble opinion, debt and education and debt for education is a personal decision.

It's not all about money

I'm sorry you have such a jaded view of our Nation.

I have always loved knowlege, I read voraciously. In fact I used to read sections of the library that I was interested in; I mean the whole section. So I know what self education is, I have two degrees so I know something of what education is. My wife came in two nights ago and told me to let this argument go. (She has a Doctorate in Education BTW) Several pages of posts later ... I wish I would have taken her advice.
Good bye, this is going nowhere.

 

And? Nobody ever said being able to diagnose a misfire on cylinder 3 is not a valuable skill. You, and the OP, on the other hand, claim that college is mostly useless, and knowing calculus is a skill that most people don't need. Me thinks, you have a chip on your shoulder.

 

You aren't talking about an investment you're talking about a hobby which is an expense. It's okay to have hobbies. I have hobbies but I don't think that I'm going to get more out of them in any tangible manner than what I put into it

learning doesn't require formal education. Some of the best things I've learned I've learned from people who work less formally educated than me.

so you prefer the gatekeeping at paywalls?

they aren't forced into it unless they have parents demanding that they go to college without paying for it themselves. You can choose not to.

the checks on public education are all government if you let the government teach you the government is going to teach you that it's your hero or your God and then it builds everything for you that's why you believe that.

You can disagree with all you want but it's factual. Government builds squat. They can't they funny have anything.

that's because I'm blaspheming your god.

the government didn't build that the people did. The people funded it the people labored on it the people designed it the people engineered it. All the government did was coordinate and remove restrictions.

Depends

Tell the schools charging outrageous prices for tuition. And building wood paneled offices. If it wasn't about money they could teach in mobile buildings but they don't do that.

I'm not jaded because I understand how it works. I think one of the problems is people believing the government is our leader when the reality is they are our servant.

yeah so do I, I just tend to different stuff. The formal study that I would probably pursue if I had seen college the way you do would have been entomology. Perfectly happy amateur. To a lesser degree herpetology. I appreciate the people that study it but write the things that I read. But I wouldn't. That's a labor of love. If I was to get a masters of anything it would be material sciences. Particularly metallurgy.

That fascinates me.

I also helped my partner get his bachelor's degree so he can teach.

outside of the need to be right why would you want to let this argument go. If you love education like you say you do part of that is talking to people with different perspectives.

I just have a different perspective than you I'm not right you're not wrong.

Where would you want it to go? I rather enjoyed it. I learned something about calculus. I always thought it was about finding the volume of like a Taurus or something I had no idea it had anything to do with compounding interest.

So if you value education you should be happy that I've learned something.

Have you not?

If I didn't learn anything about myself for about my room society or where I stand. I wouldn't talk to you at all.

 

it's not valuable to everyone. There are lawyers and doctors and engineers that don't have time or don't want to spend the time repairing things.

No man is an island. I suck at plumbing so I hire plumbers I don't need to learn this skill I just need to have a good enough return on my skills to pay someone who did.

I didn't say knowing higher mathematics was not a valuable skill. It's just that it's not necessary for a lot of people kind of like my skill.

I never claimed that college is mostly useless. I claimed an MBA was mostly useless. Nothing anybody has said directly even addresses that so I'll fortify my position.

I think getting an accounting degree is a better idea. You'll know everything an MBA knows plus you can become a CPA.

Is that why you keep misinterpreting what I say?

 

So...an MD isn't "worthwhile"?

 

My first check would be the fuel filter, the fuel itself, and for a leak at the injector line. (And check the oil, if it's a HEUI engine-I don't remember if the 3406 got that.)

 

When did I say that?

 

Do you, then, claim that a doctor can pay off all school debt in four years? If not, you said it in the post I quoted.

If so, you are woefully uninformed.

 

Good call on the fuel line.

My point was that having specific knowledge isn't unique to any given field. Certain things require more education than others

 

Never said anything about a medical doctor.

 

You posted, "If you cant(sic) go into a career where you pay off the debt in 4 years it wasn't worthwhile."

 

So you didn't see me mention doctors

 

Doctors certainly cannot pay off school loans in 4 years. Thus, you do not consider a MD worthwhile.

 

Didn't say that.

 

The United State Service branches learned a long time ago that they could take a recruit, send them to boot camp so they could clean them up, get them in physical shape, and teach them discipline. They were then able to evaluate them and offer those who showed promise schooling in a trade which lasted maybe 12 to 16 weeks. Once these guys and gals were finished with school they were sent off to different locations on need. Civil Service also hires kid's off the street and teaches and molds them to fit the needs of the job. Our shipyards have great apprenticeship programs for those selected. My Pap-paw tells me of the time he walked by a soup line and a guy shouted out "I don't belong here. I'm a college graduate". Pap-paw shouted back "I'm a Train Engineer"

 

You may not have realized it, but yes, you did.

 

That doesn't make sense.

 

Then keep rereading all my posts in this thread and the pots I quoted. It should be fairly obvious.

 

I know what I said.

 

I have a bachelor's. Ultimately didn't use it as I found a better career that didn't need it.

Most people don't actually use the vast majority of what they learn in college. It's a checking of a box.

And unfortunately our colleges don't teach students how to think they teach what to think. And most are so impressionable they never learn the self awareness to realize it.