A Fundamental Reason for Vaccine Hesitancy

The OP clearly supports what I have been saying for years, the GQP and their supporters are professional victims. All of their misfortunes are the evil libs fault.

 

Fauci funded COVID. When is he accepting responsibility for his part in causing a worldwide pandemic?

Do let us know.

 

Which has nothing to do with my post.

 

So accountability for some but not all?

 

You first.

 

So Pelosi and other Dems are hypocrites? So? Why should that change your side's behavior with respect to vaccinations?

I guess, however, that it confirms what we already know. The Trumpers will do exactly the opposite of what a Dem politician tells them to do, even if what the Dem tells them to do makes common sense and is the right thing, like getting vaccinated. It's like me talking to my teenagers. Often, to get them to do something, you have to tell them to do the exact opposite. Maybe the Dems should try this strategy and see if it works on Trumpers. It's worth a trial. We already know that the more we tell them to get vaccinated, the more they dig in their heels and refuse to do so.

 

Your OP is farcical, on its face. Is not there far more vaccine-hesitancy among Republicans than among Democrats? And isn't it elected Republicans, both in Congress, as well as in State Governorships, who not only fail to observe, but who decry the usefulness of these guidelines, to the point of taking executive, governor action, to prevent municipalities from establishing local regulations to conform with CDC guidelines?

So your thread's contention is that it is the less-than-perfect example of some Democratic leaders-- not the terrible example of many Republican leaders, or Republican animosity & legal opposition toward CDC protocols, including a lack of support for the vaccine-- which is, "THE reason for vaccine hesitancy? The reason
that the states, dominated by Republicans, have the lowest vaccination rates, is the fault of Democrats?

This claim, even amidst it's worthy competition, has got to set a new, Forum high, for both hypocrisy, and for denialism of true responsibility. (most outlandish, self-excusing scapegoating trophy).

Any R.s who support the OP's thesis, are votes against considering theirs, a Party of responsibility.

 

I didn't invent COVID. So no, it wouldn't be me at all. Not only that, but I'm vaccinated, so I have no idea what you're talking about. Or why you don't think lying scumbags like Fauci should be held accountable.

 

Oh, dear. You seem to have missed the entire point of this thread.

I do not believe in the hyped-up lethality of this disease. From what I've seen, this disease was politicized by Democrats, used especially in 2020 as a pretext to remove basic voter integrity laws. In light of how Oregon, for example, counted COVID deaths by considering those who died in motorcycle accident fatalities as having died from COVID, I think the COVID death count is inaccurate and is just as credible as the amount of votes Biden supposedly got in the 2020 presidential election.

But perhaps I and other like me are wrong. I have not had the vaccine, and I am unsure if I'll ever get it, especially in consideration that Democrat voters are speaking out of two sides of their mouths: they condemn people like me who voice opposition to the supposed lethality of this virus and then turn around and vote people in who ACT as if they don't care about the virus. Actions speak louder than words, and Democrat leaders not following the mitigation measures against this virus and Democrat voters voting them in notwithstanding is the height of hypocrisy.

I may be wrong about the virus. Perhaps it is as lethal as Democrats are claiming it is. But the hypocrisy of people like Nancy Pelosi and other Democrat leaders and their voters, including you, is the fundamental reason for vaccine hesitancy. You can bloviate all you want, but you have not argued against the basic premise. You've simply overcapitalized, overunderlined, and overweighted your font in an argument that does not address the premise and corresponding conclusion of my argument.

 

Exactly. While I did get the J&J vaccine, we now have data showing it to be less effective than originally claimed.
Not to mention, we have no earthly idea how many people have natural immunity to it, how long either immunity lasts (flu "vaccine" immunity lasts maybe 6 months).
We have no idea how people getting delta are getting it (from vaccinated or unvaccinated).
We were told if you got the vaccine, you could go back to normal. That was a LIE.
We were told if you get the vaccine, you won't get COVID. That was a lie.
We are NOT being told the actual science that even me, a vaccinated person, can, for a period of time after exposure, develop enough viral load to infect others. So that's a lie by omission.

It's just one damned lie after another.

They can't admit that they helped fund the damned thing in the first place. Fauci is still making a half million a year lying about it and flip flopping all over the place. The WHO has lied and worked with China to cover up the details in Wuhan, and what, 4,000,000 globally have allegedly died because of it now?

In what bizarro world does the guy that screwed up and funded a mass genocide get to stay employed and continue to pump out propaganda and insults? Only in leftist land.


If the left would put pressure on their own leaders to stop the damned lies, maybe more people would trust them.

 

Speaking of the skid mark on the undergarment of society, Jen Psaki was once asked if there is anything Fauci could do that would lead to his termination, and she just bluntly said, "No."

That was hilarious in a disturbing way.



Fauci is their cult leader, along with Pelosi.

 

Yep. And that's an insult to skid marks.

 

One of the fundamental criticisms against Donald Trump was his leadership. Democrats, even the ones on this forum, said, "Leadership matters." It effects the character and morale of this country. But when it comes to the leadership of Democrat leaders, well, clearly, that does not matter, according to the Democrat posters in this thread so far. All of them have vociferously defended Pelosi keeping her job. Henceforth, none of them have should have the audacity to question the leadership of any Republican. They've shown their colors, clearly.

 

Your reply is well-written, but states the false conclusion that my argument does not hold water.
You say that I missed the point of your OP. As a factual reply (& I embolden that word to actually shorten my reply, so there would normally be no need to explain-- as I am doing here, only because of your remarks about my overuse of editing tools-- that this is to contrast with the non-factual nature of your own reply; do you see how much space is saved, & how quickened is the understanding of the reader, who does not automatically assume that these purposeful variations, on my part, are not merely ego-centric affectations, but who has the ability of grasping their intents?) I will point out that your thread's title is:
A Fundamental Reason For Vaccine Hesitancy.

Further, your OP opens with these words:

So, no matter how in intelligently-sounding your didactics, if you did not intend
to give the impression that you were blaming "vaccine hesitancy," on "Democrat(ic) voters," and their leaders, then my (or anyone else's), "missing the point of (your) thread," is no one's fault but your own, because that IS the meaning, of what you wrote.

Regardless, I will show the fallacy of your allegation (whatever, exactly, you think it is)-- since it still seems, from your reply, to be laying blame at the feet of Democrats & their political leaders-- with a shorter proof:
You state that you have not yet been immunized, & are not sure if you ever will be, "especially in consideration of Democrat(ic) voters..."

So you, once more, draw some connection between your own vaccine-hesitancy (fyi, that's what the situation you described, for yourself, would be considered) and Democrats, as if the full onus of convincing you that it makes sense to follow medical advice, in the middle of a pandemic, rests upon them.

The test of the validity, & sincerity, of your charge, then, is a simple matter: if all Democratic leaders had always followed CDC guidelines, without a single slip (& I'm not convinced that Pelosi hasn't, but I will grant it, for the sake of argument), would that have resulted in your definitely, now, being vaccinated?

If the answer is no-- which we all, truthfully, know it to be-- this proves that all you are doing with this thread, is scapegoating: blaming Dems, for you and your fellow Republicans (who are proportionally over-represented among the unvaccinated) not getting vaccinated, thereby making the Delta variant-- now threatening a partial re-closure, and restriction, of both business and just "normal" citizen activity-- the
magnitude of problem that, currently, it has become.

Such an irresponsibly childish mode of behavior, as to blame others for your own decisions, makes a mockery of the longtime Republican criticisms of both minorities and the poor: that those who are complaining just don't have the moral fiber to take responsibility for their own lives, & the consequences of their own decisions.

But, of course, Republican anti-vaxers, & those influenced by them, are all the Democrats' fault. Because it's totally up to the Democrats to get us to do the sensible thing. Sure, most Democrats are doing the responsible thing, but as long as one public Democratic politician is seen doing anything questionable, it's no indictment of the common sense of any Republicans who see the enemy, not as this worldwide pandemic, but as our own government which, it is not at all indicative of paranoid delusion to believe, is intentionally poisoning millions, because, "I saw Nancy Pelosi with her mask off!"

Aren't all you Republican science-deniers special?

 

No here is another...

Nancy Pelosi Breaks Her Own Mask Mandate To Take A Photo

 

Nope, the queen b Nancy can't follow her own rules....here is another one

Despite Fining House Members Who Don’t Wear Masks, Pelosi Wears No Mask While Walking Through Crowd

 

When are you going to realize that it's passed time (to use the popular metaphor-- if Republicans don't have the patent on this one) to put your big-boy pants on, accept the reality of the situation, and act like an adult?

 

And....?

 

Because the Democrat leadership is not taken it seriously, and the voters are not holding them accountable. Nancy Pelosi was not out watering her garden willy-nilly without a care in the world during a severe drought. Or doing something unethical but for all intents and purposes trivial. She was going to a salon without a mask during a pandemic that supposedly has the same lethality as the Spanish Flu for Americans, while at the same time leading a chorus of Democrats that were lecturing us about the severity of this disease; and her voters "punished" her with another overwhelming victory, when she should have been primaried. She should have been made an example of, being the de facto leader of the Democrat Party. She was doing this in front of a backdrop where millions of people were out of work. She was doing this in front of a backdrop where people were killing themselves because of the lockdowns. She was doing this when people's dreams were burning up right in front of their eyes because of the government mandates. The enormity of her actions and the flippancy with which you address it leads people like myself to think you all are not taken this very seriously. You say one thing, but you do another. Talk is cheap. Actions speak louder than words. Perhaps you don't like that Democrat hypocrisy about COVID negatively impacts their credibility on the subject, and those defending them, whether at the ballot box or on this forum, breeds even further vaccine hesitancy. You all are clearly not taken this disease seriously. You all have and are politicizing it. Plain and simple.

 

And those of the words of someone who IS taking this pandemic seriously? You would have a better case, if you were, at least, immunized. FYI: NANCY IS. This lessens one's need for a mask because, even if there is still a chance of being infected, particularly by the Delta variant (though significantly less of a chance than for someone who hasn't been vaccinated)--

AND HERE'S THE HEADLINE--

if you've been vaccinated, the odds of your infection leading to serious problems, hospitalization, and death,
are reduced to close to nil.

So if Nancy was out, w/out a mask, the only ones who might truly suffer, would be the UNVACCINATED.

Tell me, again, why you're unvaccinated. Something to do with it being your wish, to die from Pelosi's breath-- wasn't it?



Oh, and BTW, wasting water, "willy-nilly, without a care in the world, during a severe drought," is NOT something, "trivial."

 

Republicans not getting the vax in swing states could hurt them big time in 2022 and 2024

 

No it won’t.. where are you going to get the data? I’d say Democrats will just make up false numbers like always.

 

you are wrong…. It is not close to nil at all for the vaccinated breakthrough case being hospitalized or dying….

See the Data on Breakthrough Covid Hospitalizations and Deaths by State



https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/08/10/us/covid-breakthrough-infections-vaccines.html

 

I am always willing to look at information, contradicting my understandings; I, in fact, prefer to know the truth, regardless of what that truth is. The link you provided, however, did not contradict what I said. I suppose it's just a semantic issue, inasmuch as our personal, subjective ideas of what is close to zero, could certainly differ. I will explain, in covering the numbers, why I do not feel that my description was even barely exaggerated;* but I do find calling my stated belief, "wrong," to be a far greater exaggeration (based on the info in your link).
<SNIP>

Serious coronavirus infections among vaccinated people have been relatively rare since the start of the vaccination campaign, a New York Times analysis of data from 40 states and Washington, D.C., shows. Fully vaccinated people have made up as few as 0.1 percent of and as many as 5 percent of those hospitalized with the virus in those states, and as few as 0.2 percent and as many as 6 percent of those who have died.
<END SNIP>

So, in those states in which breakthrough infections are 0.1%, or close to that end of the range, obviously the data confirms my description. The same goes for 0.2% of the deaths.

The upper parts of those two ranges, I think are outliers, starkly worse, standout states (I'm hoping the state data, which I also copied, will be comprehensible-- since columned data tends to get all bunched together, when I copy it).

As for those high-end numbers, I would not think of 5% breakthrough cases (vaccinated persons who are hospitalized) as a significant number, seeing as nearly all, it can be presumed, were immuno-compromised exceptions. But, it is slightly more than I'd imagined, based on what health officials have been telling us.

Likewise, 6% of deaths, while still being a very low number, and representing, (virtually) exclusively people with pre-existing, serious health concerns, which undoubtedly complicated their illness, is still higher than the impression one gets from medical spokespersons. While this would not constitute, "close to nil," if it were the overall percentage, I remind all that this was just from the one state w/ the highest proportion of its deaths having been immunized. It will be interesting to see if this is one of the states with the lowest vaccination rates.

So, here's the rest of the <SNIP>

There is still a lot we do not know about so-called breakthrough infections — when fully inoculated people contract the virus. And there is some evidence that these cases are becoming more common as the more transmissible Delta variant surges. While vaccines have done a remarkable job at protecting a vast majority of people from serious illness, the data in the Times analysis generally spanned the period from the start of the vaccination campaign until mid-June or July, before the Delta variant became predominant in the United States.

Breakthrough Covid-19 Hospitalizations and Deaths by State
Among fully vaccinated people in each state since vaccination began.
STATE BREAKTHROUGH HOSPITALIZATIONS AS A PCT. OF ALL COVID HOSPITALIZATIONS
AL 77 0.3%
AK 17 2.0%
AZ 379 0.5%
AR — 4.7%
CA 843 0.4%
CO 312 1.2%
DE 22 0.4%
GA 85 0.1%
ID 37 0.9%
IL 563 0.6%
IN 185 0.7%
KY 303 1.1%
LA 125 1.0%
ME 27 0.5%
MA 329 1.1%
MI 569 1.1%
MN 349 1.6%
MS 74 0.4%
MT 31 0.8%
NE 58 0.9%
NV 235 0.8%
NH 22 0.5%
NJ 195 0.3%
NM 155 2.0%
NC 321 0.5%
ND 58 1.3%
OH 205 0.2%
OK 130 0.4%
OR 191 1.1%
RI 159 4.0%
SC 162 1.3%
SD 53 1.4%
TN 218 0.6%
TX 291 0.2%
UT 230 4.3%
VT 15 0.7%
VA 145 0.3%
WA 259 0.8%
DC 13 0.1%
WV — —
WI 313 1.1%
<End Snip>

Apparently, the column for deaths was lost (I will go back, later).
So this chart, for vaccinated hospitalizations, shows nearly all states around 1%, give or take half a point. That would fit, in my mind, "close to nil," though I can see some feeling it is not close enough.

The outliers (emboldened) are just Arkansas - 4.7%
Utah 4.3
Rhode Is. 4.0

and, if you want to include a second-tier, the proportion of hospitalizations representing the vaccinated, accounts for 2%, in the two states of Alaska & New Mexico.

*Not to be overlooked, in all this, is that these numbers DO NOT SAY, for example, that about 1% of vaccinated persons, exposed to Covid, end up in the hospital; they say that OF those who go to the hospital, generally about 1% had previously received vaccination.
Therefore, as I said, this data does not even support calling my close to nil quote, a slight overstatement.

I'll also point out, because I don't believe in being misleading, in my arguments, that the data in your link only represents 40 states (& D.C.), but I have no reason to expect that this data would be inconsistent with what we find in the other 10 states.

Final recap, using data from earlier in the pandemic, vaccinated people only made up, with very few exceptions, about 1% of hospitalizations.

This number may now, with Delta, be incrementally higher.

 

If you’re not getting the shot, because trump you’re not looking out for your own self interest. That’s silly cultish behavior.
If you’re one of those self righteous needle Nazis, shut the hell up. You’re not making things better, and nobody wants to hear your BS.