A Fundamental Reason for Vaccine Hesitancy

Wow, if that's true then people are even dumber than I thought. Pelosi not wearing a mask is like a doctor not exercising. Doctors know better and suggest everybody do it, but not all of them exercise as much as they should. Sometimes they'd rather be lazy and sit on the couch after a hard day of work even if it means they'll die sooner. Does that mean exercise is useless? No. It means doctors are humans. The difference here though is that this behavior does put others at risk. Everybody knows that masks can be uncomfortable and most of us really want to take them off. So yes, Pelosi is a human who did something unsafe.

As for electing her. We don't elect leaders for their moral fortitude. I mean, conservative Christians elected Trump. Trump is the antithesis of decency. But they elected him because they believed he could advance their agenda. Same goes for Pelosi.

There's only one reason for vaccine hesitancy: Ignorance/misinformation. But why are they ignorant or misinformed? In most cases they've been lied to by republicans.

 

6 percent is not nil... nothing... zero... And yes your president outright lied when he said ""This is a simple, basic proposition. If you're vaccinated, you're not going to be hospitalized, you're not going to be in an ICU unit, and you are not going to die.''' in a CNN town hall

 

The best reason is that the long term effects are not known. I understand taking the vaccine if one is frail.

 

And the award for the Most Laughably Absurd Analogy goes to . . . LiveUninhibited!

Come on down! Take a bow.

Jeeze Louise.

These are ridiculous conversations we're having here.

There's a difference between a doctor deciding to have a lazy Sunday and a politician who rhetorically supports shutting down businesses, which led to financial ruin for many people and suicides, but yet hypocritically doing the opposite through their ACTIONS. It breeds cynicism and disgust. Additionally, the benefits of exercise have been known since time immemorial, whereas this is a novel coronavirus. Novel, quite the opposite of time immemorial. Additionally, you can go a day without exercise and still live, whereas the rhetoric for this disease is if you open your business, you're killing grandma. Thus we need to close businesses, get rid of basic voter integrity measures, have an election season, and unprecedently close down the global economy. Additionally, not to pile on, but someone not exercising is not killing other people, whereas this disease is supposedly a lethal, very contagious respiratory disease, so you, according to Democrat rhetoric, can kill someone by simply breathing near them. Yeah, you are clearly, without a doubt, making an absurd, nonsensical, cartoonishly false analogy. It's not apples and oranges; it's apples and Big Macs.

This is cultish behavior on the part of the Democrats on this forum. The fact that Nancy Pelosi got away with this, trivializing, as the de facto leader of the Democrat Party, a virus that is supposedly as lethal as the Spanish Flu, means that she can get away with anything, as her cultish supporters will keep voting her in with overwhelming victories and the Democrats on this forum will vociferously defend her and her supporter's utter hypocrisy with her flagrant enormity.

 

The analogy had its purpose, and it is to show that humans do the wrong things when it comes to their health sometimes even when they know better. Not wearing a mask wasn't being punished as involuntary manslaughter, so it's not like she got away with a crime either. Sorry, but it's actually quite logical to elect leaders based upon their ability to get things done, and not on whether they act decently in everyday life. I mean, isn't Trump an extreme example of that? Republicans must be able to understand this given what they did to our image by electing a scumbag like Trump. It was all about them thinking he'd get stuff done. And in some ways he did (federal courts), despite being kind of a moron in terms of policy.

The idea that anti-vaxxers would look to the behavior of Pelosi on masks to decide whether to get vaccinated is what's absurd here. Conservatives don't look up to Pelosi for guidance, and anybody basing their decision to get vaccinated on Pelosi's personal behavior would be so asinine. Ask doctors, look at studies, trust the evidence. That's how you decide to get vaccinated. What the **** is the point of so many people going to college if they can't even figure out how to determine something like this?

 

Ha! Ha! The idea that more people would be vaccinated if Pelosi had not been choosen by her peers to head the House is simply ludicrous!

Sure it was a mistake not to wear a mask there but it's still no cause to become hysterical about it.

And since most unvaccinated people are Repubs who strictly follow Trump's orders, I don't think they could have been convinced by Pelosi wearing a mask, which for these idiots is an example of the Dems' "authoritarianism".

 

Oh, dear. You've clearly lost the point.

No, conservatives do not look up to Nancy Pelosi for guidance. She has zero credibility, and she's pure human garbage.

But you all, you Democrats, politicized this disease. You've overdramatized it, so that you can use it as a pretext to gain more control, including over our election system. You, along with your friends in the media, had 24/7 panic porn about how serious this virus is. And then us conservatives look at the panic porn, the lockdowns, the grotesque transformation of society because of this virus and compare that to Nancy Pelosi going into a salon, in the middle of severe lockdowns, without a mask on, and we get cynical. Then when we see her voters, once again, vote her in in overwhelming numbers, we get even more cynical. Then when we see people like you defending all this hypocrisy, the incongruity between the rhetoric and the treatment of high-profiled Democrats doing the opposite, we get even more cynical. And this well-justified, well-grounded cynicism leads to vaccine hesitancy.

Not really getting your disconnect here.

Democrats: This is a super deadly disease; there should be no games about it, and people who are not doing their part to join in the mitigation efforts to get rid of this disease should be roundly condemned by everyone.
Also Democrats: But we'll still overwhelmingly elect Pelosi, despite her breaking local ordinance to do exactly the opposite of mitigation efforts to get rid of a disease that is supposedly so deadly we had to shut down the global economy, and destroy people's lives.

It does not add up. Because you do not hold Pelosi accountable, your words about the seriousness of this virus become empty, meaningless.

I'll tell you what. If Democrats primaried Pelosi and replaced her with another Democrat in light of what she did, you bet your bottom dollar that I would have been vaccinated right now. Because I would have said to myself, "They just took down Pelosi over this thing. Pelosi! The person who's been in Congress so long, she knew George Washington on a first-named basis. I am getting that vaccine as soon as it comes out. This is serious business!" But I did not see that. I saw Pelosi getting away with it, and that just reinforced my theory that this disease is just a political football used by Democrats. Plain and simple.

 

Well, that's a flawed approach to make that kind of decision but I've learned not to underestimate the stupidity of my fellow persons. Getting vaccinated is about the science, not on whether Pelosi makes a bad personal decision. You don't judge the seriousnes of a disease by whether a politician wears a mask. That's like hearing a politician had casual sex without a condom and concluding aids is no big deal. It's dumb and nobody should approach things that way.

As for the rest. No the covid pandemic was not exaggerated by the left. The Spanish flu was a more serious disease but it killed 50 million people in a less populated world (and worse yet, was actually worse for young patients than old). It's more of a values issue, where liberals are willing to be inconvenienced to save some lives. Odd it's the pro-life side against that. Not used to take more control. Public health always had this kind of authority.

That said, I would have taken a different approach that conservatives would have hated less. Masking and distancing from the beginning and using shutdowns only to force compliance, not as an economy-wrecking default approach. Then again, at first we didn't know how effective masks were, so it's kind of 20/20 hindsight.

 

Hilarious! That's a good one!

Not a single Repub, as stupid as they might be, will be dumb enough to believe a single word of your ridiculous statement!

A more credible statement from you would be this one: LOCK HER UP LOCK HER UP LOCK HER UP

 

Many of the unvaccinated are Democrats. Even after proof after proof of this is demonstrated, liberals still run around with the same myth. Typical.

 

What is so unbelievable about that statement? If you all were to throw her out after clearly violating what has been characterized as a global pandemic, killing scores of thousands, then I, for one, would definitely have taken the vaccine. Nancy Pelosi having been in Congress for as long as she has been in Congress, I would have seen that you all were actually putting your money where your mouth is. But as it stands, you all having politicized this disease, and you don't hold your own to account when they flagrantly run afoul of the official recommendations for mitigation. The begets cynicism and vaccine hesitancy.

 

So, you're telling me "with a poker face" that you didn't take the vaccine because of Pelosi!!!

OMG!!! I can't believe there are still people like you, even within the Trump fanatics!

IF that is true, I only have one comment: POOR YOU!!!

 

Pelosi is but one example. There are many examples of Democrats doing this. There are three reasons why I chose Pelosi.


1. There are too many examples of Democrats hypocrisy on this. It would take me too long to list every example of Democrats, and, unfortunately, there is a limit of how many pictures you can show in your post of Democrats violating the mitigation protocols.

2. Pelosi is the de facto leader of the Democrat Party. And (3) Pelosi has been in Congress for decades. Had she been taken out, that would have sent a clear signal that you all were being forthright about the seriousness with which you talk about this disease, by removing her from office.

 

It is absurd for a Repub to judge the seriousness of a desease by a Democrats' reaction, or lack of, to a lapse of one of their leaders.

The Dems must demonstrate to the Repubs that that desease is serious!!?? I do hope you are kidding! Dems and Repubs have access to rigorously the same information on that desease.

And you're telling me that the Repubs are not able to grasp the seriousness of the disease without the Dems' guidance!?

Well, well, well, I never imagined indoctrination could reach that level among people who are supposed to have a capacity to think by themselves.

Appalling! Just appalling!

 

This rhetorical hysteria of the Democrats does not mirror the disease, nor does it mirror the how Dem's, including the de facto leader of their party, Nancy Pelosi, behaves when they think no one is looking. Additionally, Democrats, not Republicans, are the ones that have set themselves up for the standard of how the public is to behave in regards to this disease, using it as a political tool, which is gross. They, not the Republicans, have thus politicized it. But when it comes to cashing in the check that they have written (that is, holding the de facto leader of the Democrat Party, Nancy Pelosi, to account), they let it bounce, and shrug their shoulders and point their fingers at the other side (what you are doing, whataboutism).

 

You won't be able to find any whataboutism in my arguments. I merely ridiculed yours.

Democrats are indicating "how the public is to behave" because we presently have a Democrat administration and it is their duty to issue such regulations. This is no more politicizing the matter than whenever the administration issues regulations concerning other matters, like driving rules etc...

But since the regulations were issued by a Dem administration, the Repubs had of course to go against them and found no better way than by politicizing the whole matter in order to ensure that their flocks of Trump worshipers would resist these regulations and the call to get vaccinated.

And btw, that politization seems to be working: a recent NBC poll shows that "Repubs who support Trump more than party are merely 46% vaccinated, whilst the average US adults are at 69%! (which is lower than the average European Union and even lower than countries like Uruguay and Chile, but still slightly higher than Brazil and Turkey!)

I find you're insulting your fellow Repubs when you pretend they used Pelosi's lapse (you can call it a fault if you like; I won't since I didn't see any video in which she "pranced around"; I see a picture of her walking in a room, with nobody being close to her-social distancing you know-) as a pretext not to get the vaccine. I still believe many of them are wiser than that!

Maybe you're the only one unable to think for yourself.

 

You all are the ones who have politicized this disease before there was a Democrat administration. With your hysterical rhetoric about the supposed serious deadliness of this disease, you got rid of basic voter integrity measures, increasing voter fraud, including widespread implementation of absentee voting. With your hysterical rhetoric about the supposed serious deadliness of this disease, you forced businesses to undertake undue hardship, which destroyed people lives, some of whom killed themselves by suicide. In contrast of your rhetoric, you turn a blind eye to Democrats being hypocritical about the mitigation measures, which makes people cynical, which cripples the effectiveness of Democrat leadership. Leadership, Democrats said about Trump, is a cornerstone to the character and morale of the country, which is essential to fighting a pandemic, no?

As to why I point out Nancy Pelosi, it's because she is the de facto leader of the Democrat Party. The standard is higher for her. She faced no political backlash to purposely flouting mitigation protocols. She was voted in by almost 80% of the vote. The guy who came in second was a Democrat, too, and he barely got in the teens (just 13%), and the Republican contender got less than 10% of the vote. And not only did you all NOT vote her out, you allowed her to remain Speaker of the House. Further, you did not censor her. Nothing. She faces absolutely positively ZERO political backlash in the context of a supposedly one-in-a-lifetime deadly disease, which sums up how low of virtue your party is when it comes to this disease.

Also, with each time you reply to me, defending the defenseless, I will post the photo of Nancy Pelosi along with another Democrat being a damn hypocrite.

Enjoy.

Nancy Pelosi




Gavin Newsom

 

The probability that she put the mask on when near others is laughable. Additionally, not only was she violating mitigation protocols, but she was violating local ordinance that shut down business that were not deemed essential!

Additionally, you want a video of Pelosi without a mask on next to others? Here you are.



You're welcome.

The response to COVID is theater, nothing more. They don't even believe their nonsense about this disease, and they demonstrate that when they think no one is looking. And sometimes, like in the video above, they don't care if anyone is, because they know they will get away with it, because Democrat voters, who have had the loudest voices about those who don't follow COVID mitigation protocols, still vote people who they would label anti-vax, anti-mask murderers, but because they have a "D" next to their name, they are pure as the wind-driven snow.

 

First of all, FYI, I'm not a Dem. I don't have allegiance to any party; I think for myself, which you seemingly aren't able to do.

On the video, participants are taking off their masks during a few moments for a picture.

Yes, it's a lapse, a mistake, maybe a fault, but certainly not a crime deserving such an outrage. You need to relax: your hatred for Pelosi (and for Dems in general I assume) is making you lose your nerve, to the point of making you blind to things that are obvious.

Yes, it is a deadly virus, specially the delta variant that is currently the dominant one; hundreds of millions of people around the world know that by now.

I'm sorry your political prejudices make it impossibe for you to see that. But there is nothing I can do for you, except wishing you good luck.

 

Look, no one bats 1000 in this world

But, Pelosi is one very effective Speaker.

For example, recently we learned that some 9 moderate democrats were going to block the vote on the BR bill until the smaller bipartisan bill was voted on first.

Well, the fact that the vote was indeed, held, and was successful, demonstrates that Pelosi got the job done, despite obstacles.

So, this idea that, just because she faltered on the salon thing, we should vote her out is not a valid argument.

We all make mistakes, and Pelosi has had bigger failures than that one, and she is still voted in by dems.

Overall, she's one of the most successful Speakers, since, well, Tip O'Neill and he was reelected despite the nursing home scandal.

No one's perfect, but look at them overall, weigh the good vs bad, and see what the ledger says.


Also, as @freedom8 pointed out, they were posing for the camera. So what, you are falting her for momentarily taking off her mask?

But that isn't important, the important, the very salient fact remains is this:

99.99% of all covid deaths, currently, are with those who are not vaccinated.

So, excuse democrats for siding with science.


And, @freedom8, I appreciate the fact that you can 'think for yourself', but I do resent your implication that those who are not party members have a monopoly on thinking for oneself.

I disagree with my liberal brethren on some points all the time, but I have decided to be a party member because I happen to believe that there is strength in numbers, and, as a group, I can have more impact than if I am not a party member. That, in no way, suggests that I, or any other party member, cannot think for themselves.


.

 

She's successful at tyranny. Meh. Should she be? No. She's also corrupt.

 

All fine and dandy, but your argument is that ,because of her mistake, Democrats should not, therefore, vote her back in as speaker.

I refuted that point here:

http://www.politicalforum.com/index...ccine-hesitancy.591090/page-3#post-1072885919

 

True, but the vastly larger proportion of the unvaccinated are republicans.

Everyone, dems, independents, and repubs, especially now that the vaxxes have full FDA approval, should get vaccinated.

 

You can't prove that. A large percentage of unvaccinated are millennials. The unvaccinated are largely young people. You can keep making unverified claims all you want.

 

Thank you for that clarification. Because in another post you inferred that you were an independent 'because' you can think for yourself, which implies party members cannot, which is not a true statement ( as a blanket statement).

And, I agree with your comment, overall. Not all republicans are so unwise as to not get vaccinated just because dems are getting vaccinated, though a good number of repubs are not, and a small number of dems, aren't either.