Is Jesus divine?

The Gospel According to St John: 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

John 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.

The Gospel According to St. Matthew: 19:17 And [Jesus] said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.

The Gospel According to St. Mark: 10:18 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God.

The Gospel According to St. Luke: 18:19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.

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The books of the New Testament agree that Jesus is the Son of God, and the Messiah predicted in the Old Testament. The Gospel According to St. John asserts the divinity of Jesus. The Gospels According to St. Matthew, St. Mark, and St. Luke have Jesus denying his divinity.

For a century or two Christianity was divided over the divinity of Jesus. The Nicene Creed agrees with St. John, but the passages in the other gospels remain. Many Christians believed that those who believed incorrectly about the divinity of Jesus would go to Hell.

I am a Christian who attends church regularly, and who tries to lead a good Christian life. I believe that if I need to know if Jesus is divine or not I will be told in Heaven, if I get there.

 

God in Hebrew is "Elohim" which means "Gods". This speaks of the plurality of God, Who is One. Jesus is the embodiment of the word of God, and the word of God is also God. Just like Jesus, we can be God if we are in Jesus Christ. “In Jesus Christ” means that we act in life in the same way as Jesus Christ did, fulfilling Matthew 5-6-7. But neither Jesus nor we can be God on our own, without God the Father. Therefore, Jesus denied his identity with the Father, but did not deny his unity with Him. Likewise, none of the saints can claim to be identical with Jesus Christ, but we have the opportunity to be in unity with Jesus Christ. The difference between us and Jesus Christ is that Jesus could say about himself that He is the only begotten (only) Son of God, and we can only be the collective embodiment of God and Jesus Christ in us. When we, who believe in Jesus Christ, can demonstrate our unity, the world will believe in God. The main commandment of Jesus requires unity among His disciples. Then God will become incarnate in us, just as God became incarnate in Jesus Christ 2000 years ago.

Thus, we see the transition of humanity from Adam to Christ. In the beginning, the word of God was embodied in one Jesus Christ. Then some chosen ones believed in Jesus Christ, and they will become the collective incarnation of Jesus Christ at the Second Coming. God will appear in them for the rest of the people, and then the Millennial Kingdom will begin. Over the remaining thousand years, other people will also achieve the knowledge of God, and when all of humanity begins to fulfill the Sermon on the Mount as the norm of life for every person, then God will become all in all.

There is a misconception about God as the top of a pyramid of power, where one despot, like a pharaoh, sits invisibly. In fact, the pyramid of God's power should be drawn with the point down: there is more God at the top than there are subordinates at the bottom. In particular, the Third Temple, described by the prophet Ezekiel, is wider at the top than at the lower floors.

The Nicene Creed is not a good thing. The introduction of the concept of “trinity” excludes you from participation in God, because according to this doctrine, God cannot have a number more than three. But Elohim is not three, but ANY number. The great multitude in whom God will live is shown in Revelation. And they are not a “trinity”, but they are ONE with God.

 

The first question to ask is did Jesus exist.

The answer to that question is no.

 

Well I'll be damned.... You must be the one humidity has been searching for. You know everything so therefore we can find all of the answers in you.

 

The first question I would ask would be - if Jesus was Devine, and God wanted humanity to follow the teachings of Christ, but the only
way for anyone to know that word was to have either lived where Jesus lived and hear his words, or to read his words - then why make those words
unavailable to 95% of the world's population for almost 2,000 years? Hell, one middle-aged English author was able to publish her book
in every language on Earth and distribute those volumes in less than 3 months ... one would think a "divine" being would be able to do the same
in less than 2,000 years.

Just say'n.

 

Non believers who read the gospels usually realize, "Here was a man. This part of the story could not have been invented."

 

‘Is Jesus God’ reminds me other question: ‘did Trump win 2020 elections’.

I am a rational person and I am looking for the evidence.
As to Trump winning election:
Attorney General William Barr (nominated by President Trump) didn't find election fraud
More than 50 judges (some nominated by President Trump) didn't find any fraud
Georgia Gov. Brian Kemp and Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger, both Republicans didn't find any fraud
Vice president Pence didn't find any fraud.
Supreme Court Justices Appointed by Republicans Amy Coney Barrett, Brett Kavanaugh, John Roberts didn't find any fraud.
Christopher A. Wray, Director of the FBI (Appointed by President Trump) didn't find any fraud.
Attorneys for famous Trump supporter Sidney Powell are asking a federal judge to dismiss a defamation lawsuit filed against her, claiming that “no reasonable person” thought the pro-Trump lawyer’s statements about the 2020 election results were factual.
Christopher Krebs, director of the Cybersecurity and Infrastructure Security Agency didn't find the election fraud.
Lt. Gov. Texas Dan Patrick offered a $1 million reward for any information leading to the arrest and conviction of voter fraud. The only person to claim the rewards was Lt. Gov. Fetterman of PA, who offered up two persons, both were Republicans. No one else has claimed the reward.
President Trump fleeced his supporters out of $250 million to cover the legal fees fighting the election fraud – but even he didn’t try to hire investigators, lawyers, didn’t offer any prizes for whistle blowers to discover the election fraud.

So my RATIONAL conclusion is – Trump is a loser of 2020 elections.


And now to the question ‘Is Jesus God’.

There no strong evidence that a person named Jesus Christ (Yehoshua HaNotzri) even exist.
There is no strong evidence Jesus Christ performed any miracles
The New Testament was written at least 20 years after the crucifixion and many other version of stories about Jesus were destroyed.
There is no strong evidence that Jesus Christ helped his believers
The only evidence that Jesus is God we have from the testimony of Jesus believers, but we also have similar testimony of believers in Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Sikhism, Jainism and more.

So my RATIONAL conclusion is – Jesus is not God.

 

Understanding the reality behind Christ requires studying a lot more than just gospel writings. People should study the regional historical cultural and religious context of it. People act like Christianity was unique and existed in a vacuum, but neither is the case. It developed out of a broad range of such cults, evolved to what it is now thanks to Rome in particular.

 

Jesus was one of three men who were part of a movement among the poor people of Israel There was John the Baptist, Jacob, the brother of Jesus (renamed James by the translators of the King James Bible) and Jesus. These three preached their brand of Jewish religion to the Jews and followed the law and the prophets and predicted the return of “the son of Man”.

The oral traditions of Jesus were later penned by Greek authors 20-40 years after his death and these manuscripts circulated among multiple Christian communities that each had their own traditions and beliefs. These were what became the synoptic gospels, Matthew, Mark and Luke. There is also the hypothesized “sayings gospel” of Q which together with Luke are considered the sources for Matthew and Mark. Several branches of Christianity grew, the most popular of which became the Pauline tradition which spread quickly because it did not require adherence to the law code of the Jews despite Jesus saying that not one word of it would fall away. During this time some groups of people also followed what are now considered apocryphal gospels.

60-80 years after the death of Jesus, the book of John came on the scene making its declarations of divinity. In the synoptic gospels, the spirit of god, not a personified being, came down upon Jesus at his baptism and it is from that moment on that he is anointed and his mission begins. In John, he co-exists with God as a co-equal being and always had a divine mission.

The emperor Constantine need Christianity to be united as having multiple versions of Christianity was causing infighting and division. The first council of Nicaea was held to eliminate these divisions and it is here that the Trinity doctrine is defined and codified for the first time. Opposing viewpoints are labeled as heresy and their freedom to express their beliefs eliminated. It becomes illegal to teach Christianity in other ways and writings of heretical teachers become outlawed. There is still no official canon but this is one if the first steps forward on that path.

The concept of Elohim and the plurality of gods from the Hebrew Scriptures result from the fact that Yahweh is the dominant god in a pantheon. The concept of Jehovah as the only true god evolves out of Jewish polytheism. The exile of Jews to Babylon exposes the culture to Zoroastrian concepts that merge into the Hebrew religion. It is at that time that you see God being depicted as a single being ruling over all the earth. The Genesis myths are penned which have clear origins in the Sumerian creation and flood myths. Yahweh himself, originally a storm god with a female consort named Asheroth, is amalgamated with the myths of Ba’al and El who are also gods of storms and lightning. When god says “let us make man in our image” he is not talking to a Trinity, he is talking to the court of gods over which he is head.


I am saying all this from my head so there are probably some inaccuracies in there but it’s a basic summary from a historical perspective as opposed to from a faith based perspective. For more accuracy and detail you could watch videos from Bart Ehrman or The Centre Place. Bart D Ehrman is a non-Christian who studies the Bible from a historical perspective. The Centre Place on you tube is a series of videos by a Christian pastor who teaches from a historical perspective.

 

Pure speculation.

John doesn't do this.

Definitely not.

"Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent."

According to John there is only one true God and it ain't Jesus.

Not really. The Trinity gets argued over for another 500 years or so. The Nicene creed isn't even about the Trinity. It's about Constantine taking control of the church and setting up the Roman Imperial Church.

The intense lockdown of theological discussion really didn't happen until the War Council of Trent. Before then theological discussion was relatively open. Only when imperial power was challenged, was discussion shut down.

Not really. That's not the concept described. Elohim is a category name for heavenly beings. God is a heavenly being. however, he is the only creator.

Jews were always polytheistic in that they were never faithful to God. Even now many who claim to be Jews worship the lord of murder and lies.

This is simply fantasy. No evidence exists of this. Leandro Palacios never presented any. But he did drone on and on forever.

Speculation.

Not even close. The myths and writings are dramatically different.

If a politician says, let's build a bridge across this river, are all his constituents going to participate? After God says "let's make man in our image", he is the one who does it - no one else.

You're definitely using a faith-based perspective - just an anti-Christian one. A good historian would not have speculated as much as you have nor have written fiction and declared it to be history. A good historian will be able to say "I don't know."

Bart Ehrman is a former Christian with an axe to grind because he was lied to when he was young and told the Bible was inerrant history when it is not. He will always be a middling academic at best until he drops his axe.

"Christian" being used rather loosely there.

 

When several people write about a person in ancient times, this is strong evidence that that person existed. In fact, except for a few mummified Egyptian kings, this is how we know people existed in history.

People wrote at the time that he did. Whether they told the truth or were tricked by Jesus is a matter of speculation.

This is speculation.

Do you believe Budha never existed?

Do you believe Guru Nanak never existed?

Do you believe Confucius never existed?

Do you believe Mohammed never existed?

Why focus all your hate on Jesus?

 

Most of those who call themselves Christians are part of the Roman Imperial Church. So yes, Rome has a tremendous influence. Most who study the Bible study the historical context as well. The Roman Imperial Church is not based on the Bible but on Bible and Tradition, so most who called themselves Christian don't rely on the Bible.

"It developed out of a broad range of such cults" This is popularized speculation.

 

This was a bad opening post. You don't need to look at what others said about Jesus, you can look at what they recorded him as saying.
John 3:13, John 7:38, John 8:12, 11:25, John 14:6 and 14:9

You can also read about how the pharisees interpreted what Jesus told them as blasphemy in Luke 22:66-71. If Jesus was not expressing his divinity, he would have cleared up the misunderstanding with them.

There's plenty more you read about this, if you are interested.

 

In some ways it is a semantic argument. Almost one of the "sacred mysteries", difficult for mankind to understand the precise relationship between Jesus and God.
Maybe rather than trying to formulate it into some simple doctrine, it is better to just look at what Jesus is recorded to have said about the matter.

 

The nativity stories of the Gospels of Matthew and Luke present theological problems for those who want consistent and easy to understand religious doctrines.

Matthew 1:18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.

Luke 1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.

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Why was Jesus conceived by the Holy Ghost? Why not God the Father? Also, if Jesus is the Son of God, how can he be the Son of David?

Those complexities do not keep me from being a Christian. They keep me from pondering Christian doctrines. I concentrate on going to church, and being a good person.

 

As far as getting into heaven goes, seems to me that Jesus and forgiveness and free will means you get in if you want in. The rest is all about what kind of life you live and what kind of society we build and what humanity becomes before then. I dont personally think it makes alot of sense that God made us just to worship Him until we die and then worship Him some more. He couldve made us in Heaven for that. We have a purpose, more than just worshipping Him, here on earth, and that purpose is better served by being able to make mistakes without eternal damnation ...though we can still have that if we prefer.

 

Doesn't state Jesus is the one true God.

Doesn't state Jesus is the one true God.

Doesn't state Jesus is the one true God.

Doesn't state Jesus is the one true God.

Doesn't state Jesus is the one true God.

Doesn't state Jesus is the one true God.

Jesus was never accused of saying he was the one true God.

They would not have considered him a blasphemer, they would have just considered him insane.

 

There are many Christians who are aware of these details who maintain a faith that Christ died for their sins. I don’t think understanding the historicity of the Bible necessarily means that one falls away from their faith. Scripture is god-breathed, or inspired, by God to these people. Inspired by a perfect God but written by imperfect men.

 

Luke 1:35 is more like a prediction, not an affirmation. "... shall be CALLED the Son of God."

I tend to believe there was such a character in history - one who turned Judaism upside down.

Roman and other historians of the time note the upset in that region and time of Rome's territory - a problem they needed to solve.

Was he "divine"? Some branches of the Abrahamic faiths believe so. Others believe not.

 

Jesus is divine to his own because he was conceived in a virgin by the spirit of God, overcame the world, conquered death, and set the stage for the salvation of mankind for the glory of his Father.

 

The Islamic view of Jesus is that he is a prophet second only to Muhammad and the only prophet to perform miracles through the power of God. (Someone more versed in Islam is more than welcomed to correct or add here.)

It does seem like there are some important differences between the three main branches. But it's an unreasonable stretch to declare one as the road to heaven and the others to be the road to hell.

 

true, course that is what others said about Jesus too

Matt.27:46,50: "And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, "Eli, eli, lama sabachthani?" that is to say, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" ...Jesus, when he cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost."

 

The stated consequence of rejection in all three is death and hell. Like it or not, we are all here. And wherever we hope to windup, we must head in that direction.

 

Jesus is God incarnate. Do you want scientific proof? In this day and age scientific proof exist that Jesus Christ was a supernatural being. I’ve offered it before, in fact, many times, but those that disbelief, will not be dissuaded from their disbelief. You were described throughout the Bible, and you figure heavily in the Revelations. You are on your way to hell, don’t blame God, you’re going to hell because you’re sinners and the smell of your sin is disgusting to God. He gave you a way to Wash the sin off, but you do not ask for the sin to be washed away. I pray that you acknowledge God, take him as your Lord, and ask forgiveness

 

I would say there is good evidence that Christ was in Unity Consciousness, which is a higher state of consciousness purported to be in union with God.

As Jesus Christ imparted, “the kingdom of God is within you”, signifying that God resides not just externally but within our hearts and minds. Furthermore, Jesus suggested “find yourself first”, by shedding of ego and embracing spiritual teachings to uncover our true selves and our relationship with God.