It was a bomb, not a second plane, who said a second plane...I saw it no second plane!

sounds about right!


The FBI knew all about and supplied the bomb for the 1993 WTC bombing
(1993 WTC bombing) New York Times:

Law-enforcement officials were told that terrorists were building a bomb that was eventually used to blow up the World Trade Center, and they planned to thwart the plotters by secretly substituting harmless powder for the explosives, an informer said after the blast.

http://www.nytimes.com/1993/10/28/n...n-trade-center-blast.html?src=pm&pagewanted=1

More info:

http://www.nytimes.com/1993/10/31/n...-tapes-give-rare-glimpse-of-fbi-dealings.html

The informer was to have helped the plotters build the bomb and supply the fake powder, but the plan was called off by an F.B.I. supervisor who had other ideas about how the informer, Emad A. Salem, should be used, the informer said.

The account, which is given in the transcript of hundreds of hours of tape recordings Mr. Salem secretly made of his talks with law-enforcement agents, portrays the authorities as in a far better position than previously known to foil the Feb. 26 bombing of New York City's tallest towers. The explosion left six people dead, more than 1,000 injured and damages in excess of half a billion dollars. Four men are now on trial in Manhattan Federal Court in that attack.

http://www.nytimes.com/1993/10/28/n...n-trade-center-blast.html?src=pm&pagewanted=1

http://www.nytimes.com/1993/10/31/n...-tapes-give-rare-glimpse-of-fbi-dealings.html

Besides Salems tapes there were quite a number of anomalies, which cast doubt on the OS of the 1993 bombing.

According to the testimony of Dr. Frederic Whitehurst, the FBI also concocted misleading scientific reports and pressured two leading scientists to perjure their testimony in order to support its prosecution of the men accused of the bombing.

http://www.public-action.com/SkyWriter/WacoMuseum/death/tscr/whitehur/fw_test.html

And don't forget the role of Ali Mohamed. This guy was a green beret, FBI informant and CIA agent. He trained some of the bombmakers of 1993, the leading highjackers of 9/11 and was the leader of the bombing of the U.S. Embassy in Kenya. Although he was arrested multiple times, he was never sentenced. Instead he was throughout his carreer protected by US government agencies and this protection is probably still continuing today.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/how-the-fbi-protected-al-qaeda-s-9-11-hijacking-trainer/3422

The Fed and DA supervised the making of the bomb and looked like their informant knew they were going to set him up as the patsie:

Salem: Okay. Alright. I don't think it was. If that's what you think guys, fine, but I don't think that because we was start already building the bomb which is went off in the World Trade Center. It was built by supervising supervision from the Bureau and the D.A. and we was all informed about it and we know that the bomb start to be built.

Then check out how the FBI agent ends the conversation:

Anticev: And as far as the payments go, and everything like that, they're there. I guarantee you that they are there.

Anyways, those tapes were given to the defence who never used them, very suspicious. Even the Chicago Tribune ran thr story that it was the informant who biult the bomb:

http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/chicagotribune/doc/283660292.html?FMT=ABS&FMTS=ABS:FT&type=current&date=Dec 15, 1993&author=From Tribune Wires.&pub=Chicago Tribune (pre-1997 Fulltext)&edition=&startpage=7&desc=FBI'S TIPSTER SAID HE BUILT N.Y. BOMB

But if you look at the wiki wtc 93 bombing page, it hardly mentions thus fact. It was a very successful cover up.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_Trade_Center_Bombing



but my threads are about forensics, not how many ebil people scratched their asses before eating lunch.

Fact is there is no tail damage on either building, no tail damage no plane.

 

More comedy noise and off topic conspiracy batshit.


Putting the plane in the right place and showing a picture without smoke and voila, there is the tail-fin damage.

Your drawing is 1 and a bit columns to the right of the actual impact. Do you deny this?

 

From what I've seen of this guy so far, he seems like a sincere truth-seeker.

9/11 Trick Show
https://www.richplanet.net/richp_genre.php?ref=291&part=1&gen=3


He does an analysis if the footage of the planes impacting the towers. He doesn't think they were holograms but he does think the footage of the actual impact was doctored. He also thinks the planes were specially modified to be more robust to be able to penetrate the towers more easily.

 

Quoting this because the premise was not answered!

What crazy world of batshit conspiracy do the "evil-perps" use the wrong damn engine!? The "viewers" would like an answer.

You previously ignored this:

 

Is this a joke? He isn't a truth seeker, he is a snake-oil salesman who has an online business for the gullible. Any conspiracy will make him money from fools clicking his adverts and subscribing to his batshittery.

Moronic analysis, but he is giving his eager and very gullible public something "sensational" to suck up.

An incredibly stupid claim. So now we need a team to "modify" two planes that are in constant service?
The plane needs nothing extra to penetrate the towers. The central area will compress with human bodies, luggage, seats, bulkheads, food/drink, console equipment, kitchen equipment. It would have vast kinetic force at 500+ mph! The wings laden with fuel would have the fuel thrown forwards against the leading edge, reinforcing them.

Is this your debate/argument against the daft "no-planes" in New York whilst you maintain the equally absurd "no planes" in Washington/Shanksville! MEH!

 

Here are two more vids by Richard Hall.

911 Video & Radar Analysis
https://www.richplanet.net/richp_genre.php?ref=108&part=3&gen=3

9/11 Planes, Layers of Deception
https://www.richplanet.net/richp_genre.php?ref=244&part=1&gen=3


Scroll down below the videos to see more. I haven't watched any of those yet but this guy is making a good first impression.

 

Further to my post above about the lying crank Richard D. Hall, it would appear that a lawsuit is being prepared. This slimeball actively promoted batshit on the Manchester bombings and got victims trolled by nutty conspiracy-fools. It comes as no surprise that people on this forum who believe all manner of batshittery are falling for his money-making lies.

 

I saw some stuff about the London bombing a while back but I don't remember very much. Here's a video about it.

7/7 Ripple Effect 2 by JAH - Muad' Dib



I haven't seen this particular video but I'm posting it anyway.

 

http://debunkingnoplanes.blogspot.com/2014/02/first-responder-eye-witnesses-of-planes.html
First-Responder Eyewitnesses to the Planes that Hit the WTC on 9/11

Note: This is not a comprehensive list.

Most of the quotes listed below are taken from the 9/11 Oral Histories, archived at the New York Times and taken from the World Trade Center Task Force Interviews. They can be found here:
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/html/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/met_WTC_histories_full_01.htm

EMT FAISEL
"But then we are driving and now we are like, we are about a half mile out, halfway from the World Trade Center and we see this shiny object coming and me and my partner are going, what the hell, what's wrong with that plane. What is wrong with that plane. There is something not right with that plane. And he just -- the tower http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110071.
FIREFIGHTER ERIC BERNTSEN ("Okay. We heard the explosions from the kitchen. We went up on the roof and got there just in time to see the second plane hit the towers. So we figured we would be going on that. So we ran downstairs. By the time we got down to the apparatus floor, we got the ticket. It was about five after 9.
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/
E.M.T. DAVID BLACKSBERG
"We approached the building, and we heard some loud noise. We felt some rumbling, so we looked up, and there was another plane coming in. Went behind, I guess it banked around another building, so at that time we didn't really see it hit the building, but we heard it, and we felt it, and we saw it approaching."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110134.
EMT GREGG BRADY (E.M.S.)
"At that time, we heard a lot of talking on the radio and I got a call from Captain Mark Stone saying to load up vehicle 849, a Suburban, and be waiting for him downstairs. As he arrived, we proceeded down to the north tower of World Trade Center. As we were proceeding through the Battery Park tunnel, as we came out, we saw the second plane hit the south tower. At that time, traffic was very dense and it was very hard to get through."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110184.PDF
FIREFIGHTER TIMOTHY BURKE
"I got in at 8 o'clock in the morning. The first plane had hit a little later. We watched it from the roof of the building. Then they called us to a staging area around quarter to nine I think which would be the Brooklyn battery tunnel. From the Brooklyn battery tunnel staging area we watched the second plane come in. As soon as the second plane came in they sent us into the tunnel."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110488.PDF
SUPERVISING FIRE MARSHAL ROBERT BYRNES
"I looked out the window. I could see the smoke blowing off the World Trade Center. Several moments later I noticed a second plane and I commented to myself, look at this nitwit, he's so close, and before I realized it, he had crashed into the side of the south tower."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110206.PDF
FIRE MARSHAL MICHAEL CAIN
"I set it up on the tripod in the window facing the Trade Center enclosing the top of -- the top, more like where the cash area was and I started the tape and as I was getting my fire gear ready looking out the window again, when we saw the second plane crash into the second tower. I left the tape running and I knew it was not an accident, you know, that this happened. So I gave Jim Murphy a little instruction on how to change the tape and he left the tape running."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110373.PDF
ASSISTANT CHIEF JOSEPH CALLAN (F.D.N.Y.)
"I then went and did reconnaissance of the exterior of the north tower. I saw we had numerous floors on the upper levels on fire, approximately eight floors with fire showing. As I was going around the far side of the north tower, I then saw the second plane hit the south tower. I immediately went into the lobby of the north tower to take command of operations."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110195.PDF
FIREFIGHTER JOSEPH CASALIGGI:
"I left my rollup and my standpipe kit in the lobby. I went outside to the rig, changed the cylinder. While I was changing the cylinder, I was keeping an eye because the chauffeur was hooking up to the standpipe. I was keeping an eye, making sure he didn't get hit with anything.

It was at that time when I saw the second plane hit the building. I called a mayday. I told them the second plane hit the south tower of the building. I wasn't sure which floors it was, but I knew it hit the upper floors of the south tower. Debris was falling, body parts were falling. We ducked for cover inside Engine 7, but the rig was getting bombarded with debris from the building, debris from the plane. We saw bodies crash landing right next to the rig. So we couldn't stay there."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110430.PDF
EMT JASON CHARLES (E.M.S.)
"As I'm staring at the hole in tower, I walked across the street, across Sixth Ave. to the west side of Sixth Avenue, to see Tower 2, and at the time Tower 2 was intact. It wasn't touched yet. I looked down at my son and I repeated to him I couldn't believe what was going on, and I told him, oh, my god, and heard people calling oh my god, look, look, and as I looked up, the second plane hit the second tower and there was a humongous fireball rolling up the side of the building."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110486.PDF
LIEUTENANT JOSEPH CHIAFARI (FDNY)
"We locked up the car, started heading across Church Street when we heard a roar of a jet engine, as if it was taking off in flight and we couldn't help but look into the sky to see exactly what it was and yes, it was a plane, just prior to striking the building and the engines were revved up fully. From that you saw it actually piercing the wall of the building with a large amount of fire coming from it."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110215.PDF
EMT PETER CONSTANTINE
"As we started heading down the West Side Highway, we saw the second plane, we saw both towers on fire. There was nobody on the West Side Highway after the second plane, just us and the police following each other down. We went straight through all the way down."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110122.PDF
EMT ALAN COOKE (E.M.S.)
"Somebody told me a plane crashed into the World Trade Center, so I thought it was a small engine plane. When I get to the parking lot and saw the first tower burning. Then while I was standing in the parking lot, that's when I saw the plane crash into the second tower. So my partner and Victor Camile, we got our equipment together, got the bus checked out and we were assigned to 333 Rector Street for an asthmatic. That's how we ended up going into Manhattan."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110040.PDF
EMT ALLEN CRUZ
"We both hear this rumble, and I felt a vibration, we looked slightly to the left, all of us, there's a whole bunch of us right next to my vehicle, and here comes this plane, a huge plane. The lady next to me says Oh my God, it's gonna hit the building. I didn't want to give her false information so I said Gee, I don't think so, well I hope not. I mean we're looking at it sort of in three dimensions, so I'm thinking it's gonna go behind the building. From where we're standing, it's gonna go right behind it, but it was too big and far too low. At that moment I said it's gonna hit, it's actually gonna hit. And it hit."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110047.PDF
EMT SEAN CUNNIFFE
"We were lined up on West Street, west side, right by the pedestrian bridge, between six and one, over here somewhere. I don't remember the supervisor's name, but they had us line up, put our stretchers and equipment on it. We were just waiting for further instruction.

As we were waiting there, counting the people jumping, that's when we saw the scope of it. We counted 39 people. It was sad. That's when it stopped being exciting and reality kicked in and we were hanging out.The second plane came in. It was the biggest noise I ever heard in my life.
Q. Did you see the plane?
A. Yeah. We saw it, we heard it, we felt the heat from it, the debris. We ducked under a truck..."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110164.PDF
PARAMEDIC KEVIN DARNOWSKI:
"Right before the tolls on the Brooklyn side heading towards Manhattan at the Battery Tunnel, we were sitting in traffic and we watched United Flight 175 hit tower two, which was the south tower of the World Trade Center.

At that time everybody was just in shock. The firefighters and I were just really trying to get through the traffic when the plane hit, and we were just standing there in like awe of what was happening."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110202.PDF
EMT MICHAEL D'ANGELO (E.M.S.)
"Then as I made it through traffic and I was going over the BQE extension to get back on to the Battery Tunnel, I looked and I saw the second plane hit the building. I then made a round, I made my way into a line of fire trucks using my identification and went into the Battery Tunnel."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110148.PDF
LIEUTENANT RENE DAVILA (EMS)
"Then as I'm communicating I catch from my peripheral vision on the right--I didn't even think about it hitting the building. I'm just basically like what the hell is he doing there. Before I knew it, he disappeared behind the building, and bingo, there was an explosion."
http://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/nyregion/20050812_WTC_GRAPHIC/9110075.PDF

 

In fact I do see, 20/20 all the way, but thanks for asking!

I accept your concession!

Like I said, the drawing I provided was scaled 'near' precisely to a REAL 767 against the WTC facade.

/planers​

 

ACTUAL? DENIED!

TO THE RIGHT? AFFIRMED, Thats what just blew the planer theory right out of the UNIVERSE!

ACTUAL IS to the right when lined up with the wing cuts, as the CAD drawing shows.

Last time I checked the TAIL FIN on a 767 is in the CENTER from left to right.

Wanna crash and burn? Believe the guvermint!

Yep there it is in the center alriiighty!



Just like the drawing!



Isnt reality amazing!

/planers

 

Then to add insult to injury, (of my intelligence), the same is true with wtc2 and the pentagon---NO TAIL DAMAGE! The same was true with flt 93, but that original afaik got photoshopped and vanished within 1 week.

Now the game is new releases, that use sharpening algorithms that take a smudge and make it look like there is really something there! The first plane hit just just that. The original it was a smudge that was so light you had to strain to see it, now after the cheating modifications you can actually see something.



@Scott As we can see they did a lot more than 'remaster'!
Over time the remaster will be th only one out here and of course someone is going to remaster in something that looks like an (actual) plane.


WTC 9/11 | First Plane Hit in North Tower | Jules Naudet Video (Remastered 60fps AI Upscaled)

Ace Baker Rocks

 

Gibberish. You have placed your overlay plane 1.5 columns too far to the right, the central area of the plane hits where that tailfin damage spike shows.

Do you seriously think it didn't deform during impact? Your posting shows a very simplistic understanding. I offer you no concession - cease your attempts at baiting!

I find it utterly pathetic that you just ignored an entire post of first responder accounts witnessing a plane because of some half-assed attempt to place the plane against where it struck.

All this crap because you can't explain the real issue. The columns are pushed INWARDS.

 

Wow, that is just total deception. Your yellow wedge is nowhere near my red one highlighting the tailfin damage. Folks, zoom your screen in, his yellow wedge starts just above the piece of fascia leaning 45 degrees right. My red one starts close to the end point of his one.

That was deliberate. If you put the red one in the right place, shunt the plane over to the left a column and a half it's near enough and totally obvious it must be the tailfin.

 

Thats called a squirm post folks.
No Need folks, I'll zoom in for ya!
first off my pic is taken at a different angle than his LOL
So lets compare where his tail is and my yellow mark is. (the same identical place!) LMAO



We can clearly see the upper tip of what planers are calling the tail damage.

I just used thick lines.




and it goes without saying that if I move the plane to the left so it matches the faked tail damage then the wing will no longer fit into the wing cutouts in the facade AND the faked tail damage is roughly 1/3 the height the damage would have to be for a REAL 767!!

Physically impossible to satisfy both conditions beta is demanding at the same time!

No tail damage = no plane! (well unless that was a special model that had no tail)

The absurdity of a plane! LMAO

This has been talked about for years, nothing new, just that planers try to ignore it!

Ace Baker rocks!

/planers

 

More noise. Folks will remember the deception where you changed the lines on the chopper viewed impact. This is also the kind of crap you came up with on your "sideways" plane when you isolated the "impact" before the plane got within 100ft of the building - you spent days arguing this and were too afraid to admit your comedy error. That warrants a real "LMAO". Now they can see the same here. I'll be back with a proper animation later to show this.

But you have to laugh at the "if I move the plane" horseshit. It's in the wrong place period.
The left wing doesn't hit the left most damage. The right wing hits areas that don't show impact damage. When the outline is shunted left as it should be, the tail fin damage is consistent with the tail fin position.

Then you have to laugh at the idiotic suggestion the thin tail section should have inflicted a comedy cutout without any deformation! That's a very ignorant observation. Resistance from the building exceeds the strength of the narrow edge and the leading edge of the angled fin gets pushed down, it's all so painfully simple.

Meanwhile, evaded at all costs, the columns are pushed INWARDS!

 

If you post anything less than the whole plane (so its all measureable 'like I did') everyone will know who is posting deception.

I posted the whole plane, wing tip to wing tip, bottom body to top of tail so anyone can download and MEASURE it.

I suggest you do the same if you want to be taken seriously !

I think you peeps see the writing on the wall with what he is planning too he is going to show something unmeasureable, like just the tail, mark my words!

/game over planers!

 

1.5 columns too far to the right. Columns that go inwards.

You keep denying and running away from that.

Edit, this ignores deformation that pushes the wing back and narrows it's impact zone - I don't have enough data to estimate by how much.

 

It really is fascinating to see people deny something that was not only seen live by thousands of eyewitnesses but on live TV by millions. One of those eyewitnesses was a friend of mine who clearly saw the second plane hit the tower. I'm sure he's lying, or a 'crisis actor' or....whatever.

I'm not sure whether I should feel pity for people this mentally ill or disgust at their obvious lies.

 

HOUSTON HOUSTON RED ALERT! DANGER!



I made the lines paper thin, and moved it over where beta claims its supposed to be and what do we get?

• OOps Wing too short on right side, no longer fits damage
• OOps Wing too long on left side, no longer fits damage
• OOps Tail too long NO DAMAGE because what beta thinks is TAIL damage is not!
• NO DAMAGE above betas wedge and their HAD TO BE IF IT WAS A REAL 767.

I know you were just baiting me to see it drawn out, well there you have it. All the fun stuff we do with models.

Talk about a major BLUNDER and a total FAIL!

As we can see the only rational fit is the red one, and in either case the tail is at least twice longer than Beta claims!

I did that in a manner providing all necessary data for anyone who wants to follow up and measure!

Once again: Game Over

/Planer

Oh yeh and I inserted the top of Betas tail damage in a blowup to the lower left of the same damage to prove its the same place and anyone tries to claim other wise is simply

 

Ignored of course!

1. What crazy world of batshit conspiracy do the "evil-perps" use the wrong damn engine!? The "viewers" would like an answer.

2. The exterior columns go INWARDS? They're not tilted, slanted, no magic hushabooms, no "cutter charges", put in place by psychopathic demolition experts, magically employed with incredibly free access to areas of the building.

 

Ignored of course:

HOUSTON HOUSTON RED ALERT! DANGER!



I made the lines paper thin, and moved it over where beta claims its supposed to be and what do we get?

• OOps Wing too short on right side, no longer fits damage
• OOps Wing too long on left side, no longer fits damage
• OOps Tail too long NO DAMAGE because what beta thinks is TAIL damage is not!
• NO DAMAGE above betas wedge and their HAD TO BE IF IT WAS A REAL 767.

I know you were just baiting me to see it drawn out, well there you have it. All the fun stuff we do with models.

Talk about a major BLUNDER and a total FAIL!

As we can see the only rational fit is the red one, and in either case the tail is at least twice longer than Beta claims!

I did that in a manner providing all necessary data for anyone who wants to follow up and measure!

Once again: Game Over

/Planer

Oh yeh and I inserted the top of Betas tail damage in a blowup to the lower left of the same damage to prove its the same place and anyone tries to claim other wise is simply

NO or MISSING TAIL DAMAGE = NO PLANE

 

My god, what the hell batshittery is this? Does anyone else look at that stupid diagram and wonder at the bizarre and crazy lines?

• The plane deforms as it strikes - that is, the leading corner of the wing will push the wing inwards, into the fuselage. As stated, insufficient data to tell by how much. Maybe a foot, maybe a yard.
• The tail fin will most definitely do the same. The very thin top is unlikely to cause too much damage after the leading edge pushes it backwards (again) into the fuselage. The section close to the fuselage clearly is what causes the impact damage.

Anyone who denies that has no logic or critical thinking. Expecting a cartoon plane cut-out is absolutely moronic.

Once again, the columns went inwards. INWARDS. That's impossible with any explosive, let alone magic ones invisibly-planted by psychopathic demolition experts, disguised as elevator mechanics, carrying thousands of gigantic "cutters" that have no paper trail, no company paper-work or funds, no workers who noticed thousands of these bullshit devices.

Yes, it all sounds so realistic.

p.s. no need to duplicate spam your post.

 

who comes up with this ****?

 

what?
You mean all that "how many hands does it take to wipe our asses?" foolishness I presume!