Part 12 of Post Your Tough Questions Regarding Christianity

Reverse it and look at what WR said-

...but then....

Where in Genesis does it say they "ate their babies"? Remember...you "don't add anything to the Bible"?

 

This is getting sick, stupid and ridiculous. If they did the above there would be no new generation to grow up - they would make themselves extinct.

For anyone to post that seriously they must be sick in mind or plain stupid.

It's time to put a stop to this nonsense WarRen. Whatever you believe you've put me right off your sick version of christianity. You're bordering on the bounds of decency with your suggestions. Of course there have been cannibals in the past, but no-one breeds their own kind as part of the food chain. Even our family members, the apes, are known to care for, defend and bring up their babies. If you were an adult you would know this. You're sick even to suggest it. Except in rare cases a mother loves, cares and defends her child, as do most fathers. Go away.

 

Have you researched this topic Mitt or read the Bible to find out what it tells us or are you making things up as you go along again ?

The Bible tells us that the Israelites were worshiping the same Gods as the Canaanites (as well as other foreign Gods) for most of their history up until the time Persia freed the Jews from Babylonian Captivity. The Israelites are polytheist for most of their history.

Joshua 24

Israel worshiped other Gods before Abraham and after while in Egypt. Moses leaves for a few weeks and the people go back to those Gods led by his own brother Aaron.

Do the people follow Joshua's advice ? NO

Judges 2:

So the Bible tells us that God punishes the people by letting them get defeated and then sends leaders to save them (Judges 2) http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Judges 2&version=GNT

Does this work ?

Nope.

Judges 8: We are told of Gideon who God sends to liberate the Israelites from their enemies. Does this work ?

Seems like this Baal fellow is evolving - Baal of the Covenant now ... Sounds like a grand title.

This goes on and on. The Israelites spend very little time worshiping this YHWH fellow.

We get to Solomon and he is building temples to other Gods.

By the time we get to the time of Elijah YHWH is all but forgotten. Elijah tells us that he is the only prophet left for YHWH in all of Israel. There are 450 for Baal and 400 for Asherah. 1 Kings 18.

Over the next 400 or so years from Elijah to the Babylonian captivity there is very little YHWH worship going on. The Israelites are too busy worshiping other Gods and yes child sacrifice was the custom for many of these Gods as the Bible tells us.

If you would read the book you would know these things. I have given just a brief summary but encourage you to read more.

 

Time to call the PF white coats.
I noticed, not one christian has said WR is full of BS. I guess they agree, adults ate the babies or fetuses as part of the food chain.

 

Continued from previous post:

So what have we learned ?

The ancestors of Abraham worship other Gods (This is a bit odd because Noah is still living at this time). It is beyond all reason to think that Noah would still be living and folks would not be worshiping his God. Of course the people were worshiping the God of Noah which was EL.

A short time after Abraham we have the Egyptian Captivity and the Israelite are worshiping (EL) and perhaps some Egyptian Gods.
Moses tries to start a new cult based on monotheism but as soon as he leaves for a short time the people (including his own brother) go right back to worshiping (EL) = Bull El = Golden Calf

Moses is a strong military leader and his people seem to do quite well for a time so they probably follow his religion. Clearly they stop during Joshua's time as Joshua asks them to make a choice.

After Joshua until the time of the Persians the Israelites spend far more time worshiping other Gods and forget about this YHWH fellow (as per the Bible) or he is fused with other Gods as per religious historians.

Obviously if the Israelites are worshiping other Gods such as Molech they are sacrificing children however it is also stated that YHWH is willing to accept human sacrifice from time to time.

It is true that child sacrifice is forbidden in the laws of Moses Leviticus 18

The Israelites however do not follow these laws and in fact, the Talmud has exceptions to Leviticus:

http://www.come-and-hear.com/editor/br_3.html

Child sacrifice to YHWH also is acceptable at certain times: Judges 11, Japhthah offers to sacrifice the first of his family that comes to greet him if God helps him defeat an enemy. This turns out to be his favorite daughter. God gives Japhthah victory and accepts this his sacrifice.

Apparently this must be a fairly normal and well understood practise as the daughter does not protest, does not say "Gods commands state not to do this" rather she encourages her father to keep his promise.

Solomon is a Molech worshiper: 1 Kings 11

From the time of Solomon down to the time of the Babylonian Captivity the Israelites are sacrificing their children to the God Molech:

Jeremiah 32:35 The Lord says of the Israelites at the time of Nebuchadnezzar -

(To be continued)

 

Next time you want to speak about scripture my advice would be to do a quick google search and find out what scripture actually says.

The Israelites/Jews stopped sacrificing children and adopted monotheism after the Persians rescued them from Babylonian captivity.

The Persians had adopted Zoroastrian monotheism and abhorred child sacrifice. The Jews believed that the Persian king Cyrus was favored by God and so they fused Persian religious practices into Judaism.

The OT was written and old stories edited after the Persians freed them. They attributed their downfall as a nation to displeasing God (the Gods).

This is nothing new. Almost all societies, towns, nations and so on, attributed bad things happening to displeasing the Gods.

Their belief was that God favored the Persians and so that must be the right God and they adopted Persian monotheism after 800-1000 years of polytheism after Moses and who knows how many years of polytheism (likely 1000s of years) before that.

This is not only what the Bible tells us but it is also what history and archaeology tells us.

Jesus says "the truth shall set you free" so if you want to be a follower of Jesus don't you think it is about time to start learning the truth instead of worshiping man made doctrine given to you by some local fundamentalist preacher who probably got his certificate online ?

 

Where in the Genesis that said they ate their babies and where in Genesis said God killed good people?
Another great twist fortunately it doe snot work because we are here to defend truth and fight the wicked and evil.

 

YOU claimed that the pre-Flood wicked people ate their babies....are you now saying you were telling a lie?

The reverse was simple logic that you couldn't answer.

Were there babies left outside the Ark during the Flood? Were they "wicked" babies? Did they not exist? (Again, back to the question of those wicked people not having sex)

BTW, as noted we already have CLEAR evidence God is fine with killing babies when He feels the need or desire....again 1 Samuel 15:3. So why are you so reticent to admit He would kill babies during the Flood?

Or...is it that you have NO answers to these questions? Just "God is good, says so in the Bible...quit asking logical questions about where it indicates in the Bible that He's not!"?

 

That will be your job

They have their own mind but one thing for sure we don't condone wicked and evil and we do not support the use of children as human shield.

 

BTW, anybody here starting to feel like Spencer Tracy.....with Mitt and WR alternating for the role portrayed by Fredric March?

[video=youtube;d2ctCPe51X4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d2ctCPe51X4[/video]

- - - Updated - - -

Obviously not....you seem perfectly content with God slaughtering babies and children by the bushel to get to the wicked adults.

 

Nope my claim is base on Alpha's claim that God killed children during Noah's flood I said there were no children he ask why I said probably because of cannibalism that is why God said men was pure wicked in every ways something in that sense and since he and now you tend to make assumption I am answering base on your assumption.

I did not reverse my answer you intentionally distort my answer to make it appear I said the Bible said they ate their children and at the same time you and your group refused to answer was children and babies mention in Genesis 6:5? This is your chance to prove your honesty.

This go back to Genesis 6:5 was there anything mention about babies or innocent people?

What clear evidence we have is that there are many people you for one and your group are okay in defending the wicked and evil.
The flood story and 1 Samuel 15:3 is different.
Why are you defending the wicked and evil and why you keep using children and babies as human shield?

I have just answered your questions and you have not. No where in the Bible that said God is not good that you got it right finally

 

Actually I like Spencer Tracey he is a good actor and in that movie he presented a very good argument I guess it is part of the plot to make atheist feels good this is part of Christian value to be submissive and to be conscientious objector you know offer the other cheek when strike.

 

So your claim that you don't add anything to the Bible...was the lie?

 

No, actually, like here "Drummond" used the Bible to show up "Brady"...when he was denied the use of scientific testimony in court.

And like here, we see repetitions of Brady's line "I do not think about things...I...er...do not think about!" when "Bible believing" Christians are faced with contradictions or embarrassing points....not made up from whole cloth....but QUOTES from the Bible...

AND like Brady...who was forced to start saying "Yes, the First Day might have been a 25 hour day"....they start coming up with all sorts of bizarre rationalizations...or "adding things" to the Bible... to keep propping up their made-of-sand propositions.

 

This has already been explained to you. If you do not believe that children or babies were alive at the time of the flood then fine, there are plenty of other passages in the Bible which do state directly that God commanded the killing of babies and I gave you the passages.

What is so difficult for you to understand ?

Fact God kills babies, regardless of whether or not Genesis 5-7 says so directly. Genesis 8 does not have God killing babies either but what does this have to do with the passages that do show God kills babies ?

Your beliefs make God into a trickster and I explained how. Now go back and answer the questions from my post on the "trickster God" and quit dodging the question..

You are the one that claims "God did it" OK fine "this is magic" or call it what ever you want as it does not relate to the meat of my post which you are avoiding.

If the flood did exist and God intervened after the fact to do things like get rid of the water and transport the animals back to their native land and provide them with food and so on .. this is magic or something right out of a science fiction movie (teleportation)

Regardless. If the flood really did happen there would be evidence. This evidence does not exist so God must have gotten rid of this evidence as that is the only possible explanation.

This makes God into a trickster God and it is your beliefs that make him so.

 

They make stuff up as they go along. They do I so often that they forget that what they are saying today contradicts what they said yesterday. Excellent post.

 

Really ... is this your answer to why God did not kill babies in Genesis ? People ate all the babies ? and then you turn around and state

First you make up an absolutely unbelievable and ridiculous story that is not in the Bible and makes absolutely no sense, and then you say you do not add anything to or make up things about or in the Bible.

Are you listening to yourself ? You contradict yourself from one sentence to the next.

 

Now, he's claiming "I said probably because of cannibalism".....in other words, after first ADDING that theory (with NO Biblical mention of cannibalism in Genesis).......then getting caught and denying he added things to the Bible that weren't in there......he tries to backpedal and claim "I was only offering a theory"....

and yet, his theory has NO Biblical basis.....so again, why not just come up with ANYTHING you like and say it could "probably" have happened in the Bible.

I mean, there's nothing in the Bible that says "Jesus drank a narcotic before the Crucifixon that only made him APPEAR dead on the Cross. He was later revived and only seemed to have been Resurrected.".....but there's nothing in it that says that's NOT true either.

So let's go with that theory to explain the Resurrection as nothing but a CHEMISTRY TRICK?

Seriously though, I explained WR's problem. He's trying to turn MYTHS into facts. But the Mythmakers weren't interested in being logical. They never thought about the "pre-Flood children"...or if they did, given how bloodthirsty the early Hebrew/Israelite myths were....didn't care.

But it left guys like WR in a bind 3000 years later. How does he explain the "loving and merciful God" (even more, the God that supposedly loves children and hates abortion).....DELIBERATELY MURDERING hundreds, thousands, hundreds of thousands of babies by drowning?!?!?

The Bible gives him no help. IT offers no excuse for the infanticide. So he has to make one up.

But the instant he does that?.....he contradicts his claim that he doesn't "add anything to the Bible."

 

God killed lots of women, children, and babies in the Bible. FACT. Sometimes he had these children killed in front of their parents. FACT.

Do you think God finds killing children in front of their parents entertaining ?

 

You avoid answering questions like people avoid the plague.

Now you say that "no where in the Bible does it say that God is not Good". Fair enough but what do you think?

Do you think killing children in front of their parents is good or bad ?

 

Well, in fairness, sometimes He just ordered the killing...like Heinrich Himmler and the Holocaust. Himmler personally didn't drop the Zyklon-B into the showers.

And sometimes God, as a "test", would tell a parent to kill their OWN child....and then at the last minute say "Stop! Hey...just kidding. Just wanted you to prove how much you obeyed me. That's not sick or anything, right?"

 

I have been following this absurd and painful diatribe. They claim to be answering questions but they avoid all the tough questions.

Fine, everyone prior to the flood ate all their babies. Really no point in killing everyone off through a flood then is there because, the society has already killed themselves off by eating all babies. Everyone will get old, die and there will be no offspring to continue the human race.

Here God is made out to be illogical and silly. God witnesses these people kill off their species forever and God says .. oh well, lets hasten the process like doing so is going to make a difference over the long term.

To add to the mindlessness, the whole purpose of making up the most ridiculous stories is to avoid having to admit that God kills children.

They feel that because the story does not state directly "God killed children" that the can somehow wiggle out of what is implied.

Then when shown ... No Dude... in another place in the Bible it does say that God kills children directly. They then argue but we are talking about the Genesis example like it somehow if they can show that Genesis does not have God killing children that this changes what is said in other parts of the Bible.

What I find interesting is the lengths that some will go to deny reality when it conflicts with their beliefs. This is one of the hallmarks of sophisticated mind control techniques.

 

Commanding the killing and doing it personally makes no difference in terms of responsibility.

Sometimes the Israelites did not want to kill all the women and children. The women in particular they wanted to keep as slaves.

Sometimes the Israelites defied the will of God and kept the women as slaves even though he wanted them killed. The command of God however, was clear in many cases, KILL EVERYONE.

Sometimes, when God was in a good mood he allowed the Israelites to keep women as slaves.

If you read my previous posts from today to Mitt you will find that the Israelites did not spend much time worshiping YHWH and spent most of their time worshiping other Gods and practiced child sacrifice for most of their history prior to being freed by Persia around 500 BC

 

You didn't address my point.
What does this prove?

 

I know what Scripture says, I know that God did not command them to engage in human sacrifice, they did it on their own in disobedience to Him, when they turned away from Him.

That's the point I'm making, is that when they were worshipping the one true God Yahweh and no other false gods they did not engage in ritual child (human) sacrifices because God didn't approve of it, it was an incredible evil a sin so great.

During the time of Moses when God freed them from bondage in Egypt, they certainly weren't engaging in child sacrifices to God when they were wandering in the desert for 40 years.

When you said the Israelites were engaging in human sacrifice for centuries after Moses, I thought you were insinuating that God instructed them to do that, which we know isn't true.

God said, "The sins of Israel and Judah—the sins of the people of Jerusalem, the kings, the officials, the priests, and the prophets—have stirred up my anger. My people have turned their backs on me and have refused to return. Even though I diligently taught them, they would not receive instruction or obey. They have set up their abominable idols right in my own Temple, defiling it. They have built pagan shrines to Baal in the valley of Ben-Hinnom, and there they sacrifice their sons and daughters to Molech. I have never commanded such a horrible deed; it never even crossed my mind to command such a thing. What an incredible evil, causing Judah to sin so greatly!"---Jeremiah 32:32-35 NLT