SOON:Revolution in Russia

Its russia dude, deal with it.
Russia never had democracy and wont have in next decades.

 

heh, yeah, Russians used to be very educated and polite people. The new generation has a lot to take after their parents and grand parents.

It was long way for 200 years to come close to real democracy in America. Hopefully, it will take faster for Russia ... if Russia will not change her course back to dictatorship of course

 

Huh? Maybe only to people who reside in a tiny countries as Monaco is.

 

They are still polite and educated, but once they faced a 'wild, wild, West' they picked things very fast because, imagine that, they are smart as well .

 

What is the point?

 

Peter did not try, he really did. Obviously you studied the history of his time one-sidedly. First of all he is considered as the reformer which has made reforms of all spheres of the life of Russian state: tax reform, military reform, reform of the government, cultural transformations and even the church one. It is obvious, though I understand for someone he is only the conqueror and nothing more.
As to cruelty. Like all great people, his person has acquired with myths. He was cruel no more and not less than all his contemporaries. His daddy Alexey Tishajshshchy has killed about 150 thousands persons. Nobody names his as tyrant. Ivan the Terrible is acquired with myths too as the great tyrant, though by some estimations he has executed 4 - 32 thousands persons. While his contemporary Henry VIII has killed 72 thousands. All population of Russia at Peter's the Great time was about 15 millions persons. Even Peter could not tell you More exact figure - as he made population census several times and every time landowners concealed a part of their peasants in the order to pay less taxes. But in any case the mistake could not be more than 10 - 20 %. And in any case the population of Russia was less than the population of France at that time, which was about 20 millions persons. Peter was cruel up to the certain degree, but do not exaggerate his cruelty.
I see many people like to create legends about Russian leaders. The same situation with Stalin. Some people attribute to him 20-60 millions victims but nobody is able to prove the validity of these figures. Moreover real figures of his victims are known, but people prefer to operate with myths. Probably because myths are smarter. But they do not have any relationship to history.

 

That was my actual point. Henry is known as most bloodies leader of England. But Russian people prefer to remember their leaders as "reformers" but not as butchers.

I can subscribe under every word you said about Piter. BTW, Napoleon is also very well known as militaristic fanatic and conqueror outside of France. But French remember him as reformer to " .. tax reform, military reform, reform of the government, cultural transformations and even the church one."

Honestly, we will not come to any conclusion by talking about Peter and others because we put different values on the balance I believe this is the difference between Russia and Western World - different values on the balance.

 

Where is the action? I think the USA will be in revolution before Russia.

 

I suggest you to go back to school and study some History first, before making dumb assumptions. People might think that you are ignorant idiot, you know.

For example in 12-th century France population was 12(!) million, Germany had 9 (!) million while Rus' combined had about 2 million. In 1600 France had 20 million, while Russia had 9,6 million. At the begining of the 20-th century Germany had 56 million, France had 40 million and Russia (surprise-surprise) had 67 million already. Now Germany is 81 million, France is 60 million and this not-loving-people Russia is 141 million.

Perfect illustration of Europe being a bloody swamp for centuries in comparison with Russia.

..... and about 100,000 people executed and accused of being witches under the rule of his precious (?) daughter (?) Elizabeth I.

 

The main difference between Russia and the Western world is hypocrisy. I spoke you about Henry VIII, but I have not told about his daughter which outdid her father. By some estimations she has killed more than 100 thousands persons. How many persons has killed Lui XIV? How many persons has killed Cromwell? Should I continue the list? This is my point - hypocrisy. Actually it is funny to look at our former compatriots speaking about different values. What values? Nowdays Americans have killed 1 million of Iraqis and all of this presented as the celebration of a democracy. We really will not come to any conclusion not owing to various values, but owing to your unwillingness to accept the fact the Russian history has the little different from a history of other countries and develops according to the same laws.

P.S. The interesting fact Mary I had the nickname Bloody though in the years of her ruling were killed only 400 persons. So not only Russian monarches are defamed according to political reasons.

 

yeah, with the only difference that it was in middle ages. I let you to feel you win our discussion. I have no interest in dispute where I have to say "this is good and this is bad". I'm not a judge and I don't want to look like "smart ass" in something I might don't know. I shared my opinion, it might be mistaken. And thx God if it is.

to KGB agent
You leader is former KGB agent and never use arrogant language. Once you've taken this nick I advise you to follow Mr.Putin habit to call your opponents - partners. It makes you look civilized even if you are not.

 

Yeah, also he enjoys to tell harsh truth sometimes. I hope you enjoy me saying the truth too.

 

Thanks you for your permission to feel me the winner of the dispute. But I'm not going to win anybody as a historian and a guy blabing about history are initially in the different weight categories. Actually it is interesting for me to look at mentor guys at the moment when they learn that their own history is full of maniacs, murderers and rapists. I can dig up a heap of crap about every period of every country, it is not difficult for me. But the trouble is people do not do conclusions and more of that continue to make crimes teaching values to someone. Also the history of every country consists not only of crap and every crap which you can find has it's political and logic explanation.

 

You do not take into account that there are a history experts and a crap experts and "never the twain shall meet".

 

Yeah, but I'm not going to accept any "logical explanations" if political crime was aimed against its own population. And that the whole Russia history is about.

 

What you radiate is what you attract (Serbian: како зрачиш-тако и привлачи&#1096.

 

Are you the great the expert on Russian history to do such statements? If you are the expert I can check up as far as it corresponds to the reality.

 

However, so many MaxRiga here ! Come on Max! You have no idea how much fun we get talking with you

 

I wouldn’t say I'm professional historian but I know enough to make such statement.

 

Ok! In this case two simple questions.
1. What kinds of death punishment and for what crimes were provided with the Russian legislation at XI - XIII centuries?
2. How many persons executed Elizabeth of Russia at 1754 or what has happened at 1754?
Good luck!

If someone knows answers to these questions, do not answer please. I need MaxRiga answers only.

 

lol, u r funny
how about giving me prize for the right answers?
while you are thinking what kind of prize would be interesting for me you can answer two simple questions:
1- why Russia is always many steps behind the west in living standards?
2- why Russians always want to argue how good they are while living as poor people?
If someone knows the answers you are free to answer, those are open questions

 

Okay...so you know nothing about history of Russia, but still making dumb assumptions. I guess Potap will accept your surrender.
When I told you, that people might start think, that you are ignorant idiot - I wasn't kidding. Got bad news for you, bro.

 

This is the bad manner not having answered questions of opponents to ask own questions. Dont you know? By the way as you ask about all the period of Russian history you should know that Russia of XVI - XVIII centuries is one of the centers of immigration as the standard of living in Russia for that moment was higher than in many countries of West Europe. Read works of "Free Economic Society" edited at XVIII century and do not ask silly questions.
Now about my questions. I repeat them.
1. What kinds of death punishment and for what crimes were provided with the Russian legislation at XI - XIII centuries?
2. How many persons executed Elizabeth of Russia at 1754 or what has happened at 1754?
I do not ask difficult questions. Answers are very easy. If you have difficulty do not hasten, you have 15 - 20 hours. Visit library use GOOGLE. I look forward to answers. Good luck!

And I repeat my request again. If someone knows answers to these questions, do not answer please. I need MaxRiga answers only.

 

How did Catherine the Great die?