To all the border bellyachers out there, tell me what YOU would do, if YOU were President

It is my position that discussing forum rules regarding quoting posts was YOUR argument. I guess you are now saying that it is MY argument.

One thing is for certain, one of us is out of their mind because this concept was without question being driven by one of us....

I assure you that this rules tangent that is being discussed is owned 100% by you. I have merely responded to your whining on the subject.

Please refrain from silly gaslighting. You are fooling no one.






...

 

I'm not sure. Perhaps because the table that I quoted ends in March 2023?

 

Then why isn't Biden doing just that?

Look at the totals rather than the averages.

 

Take what I post at face value, please. And I will return you the favor.

 

THe cruel aspects of Trump's policy have to be reversed, sorry.

Cruelty is not anything any person who has a decent bone in their body, would support.

 

So let me get this straight. They thought the policies were "Cruel", so instead of making them better, they scrap them completely, let 10x the amount of illegals enter for three years and THEN boom, now they care cause its election year?
PUH-LEASE
We see right through all this BS

 

Yep, accounted for. Which is why I mentioned the 113k missing number also.

 

I did. Which is why I asked the question. Because much of your OP bashes Republicans. Treats them as if they don't know anything, as if they're stupid. I also considered a prior conversation with you when you had asked a similar type question regarding gun control.

 

I say we hire Egypt to build the walls that keep the "palestinians" out of Egypt. That **** works great.

 

Would that be transposting?

 

Can't wait to apply that to the 2nd.

 

The 14th is fine the way it is.

"and subject to the jurisdiction thereof" is more than enough.

Illegal aliens having birth in our country are not subject to the US. They're a subject of the country they're from.

That's why when they're deported, they go back to the country that does have jurisdiction over them.

 

Thank you for acknowledging the fact that it's a complex, and large, problem. Seems to me some folks on this forum appear to have lost sight of that fact.

Now then:

The policy proposals you have listed touch on several aspects of immigration control and border security. Each has its own implications and potential impacts, which can be discussed in terms of their merits and challenges.

1. Reinstate "Remain in Mexico" for Asylum Seekers: This policy, formally known as the Migrant Protection Protocols (MPP), requires asylum seekers to wait in Mexico for their court hearings in the United States. Merits of this policy could include reducing the strain on U.S. immigration facilities and deterring frivolous or weak asylum claims by making the process less immediately accessible. However, challenges include humanitarian concerns about the safety and welfare of asylum seekers waiting in Mexico, potential violations of international asylum laws, and the strain on Mexican border cities.
   
   
2. Strengthen E-Verify and Penalties for Employing Unauthorized Workers: E-Verify is an internet-based system that allows businesses to determine the eligibility of their employees to work in the United States. Merits include potentially reducing the incentive for illegal immigration by making it harder for unauthorized immigrants to find work. However, challenges may include the burden on small businesses to comply with additional regulations, potential errors in the system leading to wrongful employment denials, and concerns about privacy and data security.
   
   
3. Tighten Physical and Technical Border Security: This proposal includes enhancing physical barriers, such as walls or fences, and employing technology like surveillance drones and sensors. Merits include potentially reducing illegal crossings by creating physical and technological deterrents. Challenges involve the high costs associated with building and maintaining these structures and technologies, environmental concerns, and the effectiveness of such measures as people may find other ways to cross or circumvent barriers.
   
   
4. Abolish Sanctuary Cities and Reduce Federal Funds: Sanctuary cities limit their cooperation with the national government's effort to enforce immigration law. Merits of abolishing them may include increased cooperation with federal immigration enforcement and potentially reducing the incentive for illegal immigration. Challenges include concerns over community safety, as individuals might be less likely to report crimes or cooperate with police out of fear of deportation, and the impact on federalism principles by compelling local jurisdictions to enforce federal immigration laws.
   
   
5. Abolish Birthright Citizenship: This proposal challenges the 14th Amendment's provision that grants citizenship to all persons born in the U.S. Merits might include reducing "birth tourism" and the incentive for illegal immigrants to have children in the U.S. However, challenges include significant constitutional hurdles, as this would require amending the Constitution, and ethical concerns about creating a class of stateless individuals born in the U.S. who do not have citizenship anywhere.
   
   
6. Establish a "Guest Worker" Visa: This program would allow for temporary workers to fill jobs that are purportedly not filled by Americans. Merits include addressing labor shortages in certain sectors and providing a legal pathway for immigrants that could reduce illegal border crossings. Challenges could involve ensuring the rights and fair treatment of guest workers, preventing abuse of the system by employers, and the potential impact on domestic workers' wages and job opportunities. If done right, I'm for this idea. There is a labor shortage.

Each of these proposals carries complex implications for immigration policy, border control, and the broader social and economic fabric of the United States. Policymakers must weigh these factors carefully, considering both the practical and ethical dimensions of immigration reform.


But, will your ideas solve the border problem?

The effectiveness of the proposed policies in solving the border problem depends on how one defines the "border problem" and the goals of border and immigration policy. These policies aim to tighten border security, regulate the flow of migrants, and address the legal and economic factors that drive immigration. Let's analyze the potential impact in the context of these goals:

1. Reinstate "Remain in Mexico" for Asylum Seekers: This could reduce the immediate pressure on U.S. border facilities and deter some migrants from making the journey. However, it does not address the root causes of migration, such as violence, political instability, and economic hardship in home countries. Therefore, while it might reduce numbers in the short term, it's not a comprehensive solution to the broader issues driving migration.
   
   
2. Strengthen E-Verify and Penalties for Employing Unauthorized Workers: By reducing the employment opportunities for unauthorized immigrants, this policy could potentially decrease the economic incentive for illegal immigration. However, enforcement challenges and the potential for pushing the undocumented population into more precarious, informal employment could mitigate its effectiveness.
   
   
3. Tighten Physical and Technical Border Security: Enhancing physical barriers and surveillance could deter illegal crossings to some extent but would not stop it entirely. Innovative smugglers and desperate migrants often find ways around such barriers. This approach also does not address visa overstays, a significant source of unauthorized residency in the U.S.
   
   
4. Abolish Sanctuary Cities and Reduce Federal Funds: This could increase cooperation with federal immigration enforcement but might not significantly reduce unauthorized immigration. It could also undermine trust between immigrant communities and local law enforcement, impacting public safety.
   
   
5. Abolish Birthright Citizenship: This is a long-term measure that faces significant constitutional and ethical challenges. It would not address current unauthorized immigration and could lead to legal and humanitarian issues regarding stateless children.
   
   
6. Establish a "Guest Worker" Visa: By providing a legal avenue for migration, this could reduce illegal border crossings and meet labor demands in certain sectors. However, its success would depend on the program's design, including protections for workers' rights and its responsiveness to the labor market's needs. I would support this, if done right.

So, in summary, while your policy proposals might address certain aspects of the border problem, they are unlikely to solve it entirely due to the complex, multifaceted nature of migration. Effective solutions would likely require a combination of secure borders, legal pathways for immigration, and addressing the root causes of migration in sending countries. Collaboration with other nations, particularly those that are significant sources of migrants, and comprehensive immigration reform in the U.S. would also be crucial elements of a holistic approach to the border problem.

My entire point for this thread is so show people a simple solution is no solution. There is no simple solution, if, indeed, the border problem can be dealt with to a level satisfactory to all concerned since at all, because, as far as I can tell, it never has in the history of the United States and my memory goes back to the 60s.

 

post of the week award

 

Without space to respond fully to your remarks, I will say you raise some good points; as I tried to imply in my first post there IS NO immediate answer that doesn't bring with it consequences.

As I also suggested this problem is not going to be solved by one massive bill. IMHO the first step HAS to be curtaining the inflow. I live near San Diego as you do, and I recall the problems Remain in Mexico caused, BUT slowing the inflow to a manageable rate has to be a first step. Dumping thousands of illegals onto the US population with the problems and disruptions that's cause hasn't to be stopped or curtailed significantly. When it becomes clear to potential immigrants that they're NOT going to be allowed in and treated to food, shelter, and healthcare at the humongous expense of the American people UNTIL their records and health status is determined, I suspect the flows will subsided.

 

null

 

Double check that. I think you're incorrect.

 

How so?

 

Does this Ukrainian aid pork bill that the left is trying to spin words into "border" still have half going to Ukraine?....

 

Look up "birthright citizenship".

 

Oh I'm aware.

It's been a long time since the Hamdi and Wong Kim Ark rulings.

The scope of the 14th was written for the black population and, at the time, didn't even cover Native Americans.

We already know that the 14th doesn't cover the children of foreign diplomats...why? Because they're subject to the jurisdiction of the country they are from.

Illegal aliens are no different. That's why I said when deporting them, we send them back to the country that DOES have jurisdiction.

The 14th was never intended to include children of those in the country illegally.

 

Well I won't be President, but I would recommend to a new President to begin enforcing the law as written.

Section 235(b)(2)(A) of the Immigration and Nationality Act requires that all applicants for admission into the US who are not already clearly allowed in need to be detained for removal proceedings. That of course includes asylum seekers. This is one way the administration is in violation of the law right now. They are doing catch and release and that's simply illegal. Obviously there are tons of things to do but this one thing would take the wind out of the sails of future asylum seekers if they know when they get here they will be detained, likely for years, while working through the asylum process.

 

It has to be done in a humane way. Trump's policies are needlessly cruel, and in you are getting numbers down because the policies are cruel this is not acceptable to democrats or it isn't acceptable to me. Note that I don't mean to imply deportation per se is cruel

Thing is no one has a solution that will totally solve the problem because it's like crime; we can put a dent in it and that's the best we can do.

 

You mean.....the wall made it worse?

Um.....no, it's not illegal to not enforce some aspects of laws. You enforce what you can, and have resources for.

 

So are the rapes, murders, burglaries and theft increased we've suffered through th past three years.
[qute=pds]
Thing is no one has a solution that will totally solve the problem because it's like crime; we can put a dent in it and that's the best we can do.[/QUOTE]
Nothing cruel about enforcing borders and immigration laws like any other nation. Obvious the system we've used for the past three years.