When The Russian Hoax Is Exposed, Should The Democrats Be Held Accountable?

There is NO question that the Trump campaign was in constant secret contact with the Russians. Does it rise to the level of collusion? Probably not. Consider that the Russian ambassador ratted out Flynn and Kushner. Spin that.

 

No freedom of speech for you.........

 

Regardless of whether or not you agree with it, the joint statement still took place. The point is, saying that 17 intelligence agencies made a joint statement on Russia meddling with our elections wasn't just something that was made up by the media.

 

You may have hit a nerve.......

 

If it in fact is true that Russia collusion is a hoax then she should be fired for lying to millions of people and for pushing us closer towards WW3. It's got nothing to do with freedom of speech.

 

They made a joint statement, but I'm not going to give it the level of strength they wanted me to give it, by making the other 14 nod their head. Especially when the 'non-classified' report is rather loose in my opinion. What they called a sophisticated operation was actually a very basic one in hacking terms. Anyone could have utilized the same technologies.

Now I will admit, I don't (obviously) have the classified version, so who knows maybe there's a higher sophistication that if revealed would also have revealed government secrets. I will reluctantly consider this possibility. However, based on the non-classified report, I do know one thing:

It could ONLY have been done if they had knowledge of the email addresses(and that they'd click) and the ability to bait government officials into clicking the emails. This in of itself is the greatest proof of collusion. Someone aided the Russians from the inside to hack the DNC.

No, I'm not gonna go on the "Seth Rich" thing. But based on the report, I do believe(just as with the leaks and everything else), that we have moles/traitors on the inside. At this point, perhaps there are moles on both sides of the fence.

 

No.. Its not a hoax. The Trump campaign had 18 secret communications with the Russians before the election. That's well documented.

By May 20th they were looking at Kushner and 4 days later the Russian Ambassador ratted out Kushner and Flynn's request to set up a secret back channel to the Kremlin on December 2.

Collusion? May not rise to the level of a crime, but its deceitful.

You may want to look up the definition of HOAX.

As for Madow.. how many other reporters do you want fired or stifled? Or, maybe even better we could have a media blackout on everything Trump says and does.

 

LOLOL.. The FBI intercepted 18 secret communications between the senior people at the Trump campaign and then the Russian ambassador ratted out the Dec 2 request by Flynn and Kushner to use Russian communications equipment to talk with the Kremlin.

 

That's fine, and I'm not trying to argue that you're wrong for not giving their joint statement the level of strength that they intended. I'm just trying to stick with the facts here, I've got other people (not you) who are either denying that the joint statement took place, or don't understand that the intelligence community's joint statement represented 17 agencies (again, not saying that all 17 agencies took part in the investigations)

As for the evidence that Russia was behind the hackings, the most significant information I know of that isn't classified is the fact that the melware that was found on the DNC computers was discovered to be sending information to an IP address based in Russia. Another thing worth noting is there were apparently multiple sources leaking information from within the DNC, so it can be hard to conclude what information (if any) was leaked due to Russia's involvement. I see many people try to claim that the publishes made by wikileaks were from a Russian hacking, but there's no proof that is true.

 

Since you are so convinced then please tell me what has trump done to benefit Russia since he became president? As far as I could tell he has only done 2 things concerning Russia and both those things have caused further damage in our relationship with them. 1. Trump killed the oil deal with Exxon and Russia. 2. He bombed Syria (Russia's ally). I want all of mainstream media shut down. And it's got nothing to do with Trump. I don't even like the guy... I only like truth and mainstream media does a pretty crappy job of being an outlet for that.

 

Basically, I want to the bottom of this just like any other American should. If it's proven irrefutably that it's Russia, then it's Russia. If on the other hand, the criminals tried to mislead our investigators into thinking its Russia then they succeeded at that as well. And with people like Michael Flynn, we should be wary of the possibility of inside criminals.

Think a master hacker wouldn't want to get in on corrupt Russian money, for basically US Government data? Why not lol.

 

You are missing something. I expect that you are deliberately missing it.

Since the very first sentence in the very first link you posted makes it clear that the joint statement was on behalf of all 17 agencies.

 

Did you read and understand anything that Tcassa wrote???

 

So far, Trump hasn't done anything for the Russians, and isn't likely to in any overt way. His chaotic and incompetent Adminstration has brought so much focus onto itself with its arrogance, bungling, and irresponsibility, that the Russians must be feeling duly stung (hence Kisliak dropping the dime on Kushner).

The Russians really wanted the Exxon deal. They also wanted American acquiesecence to Russian expansion in Europe and de facto assurance that the Americans would lay off Russia's efforts to back up their client, Assad.

The got the latter two, but not the first.

Although the US launched a one time air strike in Syrian air bases, they have done nothing else. Nor has the US silence over Assad's war crimes changed. Assad has a free hand in Syria as far as the Trump Administration is concerned.

Moscow certainly took heart last week as Trump hectored the other members of the Western alliance over defense spending (not dues, as some of the more stupid right wingers keep claiming, NATO does not have "dues"). Trump's pseudo/ sometimes isolationism has people worried in every capitol in Europe EXCEPT Moscow.

 

Excellent post.

 

They didn't need our permission to expand in Europe, if they were going to do that, they would've done it already. "Aww, the Ukraine". Yeah, that ongoing 5 year stalemate. We should be focusing our efforts on ENDING that civil war, but by no means is it a result of Russian Aggression. Likewise, whether or not Crimea is Russian is inconsequential to the rest of the world no matter how much they bleap about the "integrity" of the INTL Community.

The little sea port isn't changing anything, and the people of Crimea obviously wanted to be pro-Russian. It's not worth US troops, or for that matter INTL Sanctions. Some may fear that if we "let Crimea slide", it would result in further 'aggression' but this obviously isn't the case given that there haven't been new developments.

No, Europe and Russia need to come to a deal. I'll be more than happy to play peacemaker between the two. Now's the time to defuse tensions.

 

I asked who he rapes and you cite his admission of groping?

 

Is groping OK? Why do you raise the question of rape?

 

Yeah, groping is the best!!!

You have to go too far back in the thread to understand, but someone compared Trump's to (Bill) Clinton's assaultive behaviour. I believe Juanita Brodderick, though no Democrat does, hence the rape reference, and if you take Trump's taped confession seriously, he was claiming his behaviour was a) not rape; and B) welcomed by women who liked stars.

 

See my post above re Juanita B.

 

I don't believe Brodderick.. She was a grown woman.. and even after all these years she weeps and carries on. Why didn't she say NO years ago?

 

1) Okay,

2) I don't know, and

3) I can only surmise that she assumed no one would believe her, Hillary's admirable inclinations to believe victims notwithstanding. And as we see, you don't.

Weeping while reliving a rape by a powerful person, on camera, doesn't surprise me. She strikes me as a relatively weak person, as does Monica Lewinsky. A perfect victim for the likes of Bill and not capable of shrugging it off.

With everything we know about Bill's libido and mendacity, there is no reason to believe him over her. Hillary surely doesn't.

 

They should be exiled at the voting booth!

 

I have had powerful men try to play grabass with me.. You give them a hard shove and tell them if they keep it up, they won't believe what happens next.. Brodderick is either a pathetically weak sob sister or a liar.

 

The Marxist Democrats in the House and the Senate are an authority force with no accountability either. Same with the lamestreammedia. Both of these groups are no different than the secret police of Lenin, Stalin, and Mao.

It's ironic that you speak of "no due process". Claims that the Trump campaign colluded with the Russians to "fix" the election also consist of "no due process". Due process includes the provision of evidence, including probable cause. We have seen NOTHING provided as far as evidence is concerned other than understandable contacts with the Russians.

Investigations with NO PROBABLE CAUSE should be an anathema in a free society. Such just *reeks* of secret police tactics!

"it is to investigate and find out if there was a collusion involving any state or campaign officials." Think about what you are saying! How do you prove a negative? That is why investigations *HAVE* to have probable cause to even begin. Mere allegations are not enough. How do you prove a false allegation to be false? If I charge you with colluding with the Russians and you have not done so how do you prove that you haven't? Especially if you *have* been in contact with Russians?

Have *you* seen any evidence that Russia interfered in our election? I keep hearing allegations that they did but *never* any evidence offered up as proof. If you want to innoculate the people against Russian interference then you *must* provide them evidence of what to look out for in the future! Otherwise all these claims of Russian interference become nothing more than Peter and the Wolf claims. The people *will* begin to tune them out. The polls show evidence that this is already beginning!

It was *NOT* illegal for Flynn to be paid by anyone for a speech. He failed to ask for permission to do so, however. That was a violation of the rules. Do you not understand how the Marxist Democrats and the lamestreammedia has corrupted your view of what Flynn did? They have convicted him of a crime that doesn't exist while ignoring the actual violation he committed.

It's the same tactic the secret police under Lenin, Stalin, and Mao used to convict someone. Just make it up and repeat it often enough and it becomes the truth!