You might be more moral than you realize

Jesus never said He would bail us out of every situation and to be frank, your OP is not very clear on what you are asking.

Maybe you could ask your question more simply unless your point is just to confuse people. What in the world is this more yes or more no thing you keep rambling on about?

 

Sounds like a disgusting message: kill those who hear a different voice in their heads (aka have a different invisible friend in the sky.) Sounds sick and depraved. I'm glad I left that cult.

 

What in the world are you even talking about?

 

It is because I'm thoughtful... But I don't intend on explaining myself again.

 

More "yes", or more "no": would YOU, if you possessed Jesus' magic super-powers, have helped those 9 people?
Remember, they were in a building built to worship YOU (you are Jesus in this example), and were in the process of worshipping YOU, and likely cried out YOUR name to help them as the evil racist mowed them down, innocent people, one by one ("help us Jesus!!!").

A moral Modern Secular Humanist would not only answer "heck yes!", but would likely offer themselves in place of the 9 innocent people, if they were given that opportunity, since they are so caring about their fellow human being. But Christians clearly can't even answer "more yes", but less "heck yes!".

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No, it's because you don't want to admit to yourself that 80% of humanity (the religious people) are insane, because they clearly can't answer "more yes" to the OP.
This thread is separating the moral people from the immoral people.

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Moses had them killed because they worshipped a different god.
That would be like the US nuking Nepal because they mostly have a different god than the US does.

 

Why would I?

Jesus never said He would save everyone when they asked, we were told in the Bible to be prepared for death. Why does it matter if you are gunned down or develop cancer?

And what in the world does being in a Church have to do with anything?

Its just a building.

 

How so? I answered your request "Your thoughts?" at the end of your post. Undeclared extrapolation is a dangerous game.

Just as in the pope thread, I agree with you on the issue you're trying to address, the morality part, but I disagree with many of the details of how the question is posed, as well as with some conclusions I fear you might draw from an unnuanced answer.

 

Personally I have always thought I was just as moral as a person can be in a given situation.
If there was a omnipotent loving god he would have no reason not to have perfect morals. Free Will is a bit of a red herring, the concept exists not to explain mans actions but to explain gods lack of action.

 

That's not what I'm claiming, I'm just claiming that Christians who can't answer "more yes" are immoral, and that most of them can't answer "more yes". The fear of possibly being more moral than Jesus in this example scares the living crap out of them! Jesus has brainwashed them, clearly.

There is a price to be paid for faith.

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I'm impressed by you. Christians, and their magic invisible friend in the sky, not so much.

 

With all due respect, I have no idea what you are talking about and I have multiple degrees so I am not stupid.

You asked what I would do if I were Jesus and I told you.

I then explained, very clearly my logic behind that decision.

You seem to want to twist things for some conclusion you want that is way outside of the answer we can give you.

I am here to openly discuss anything with you and answer all your questions but you need to come back down to earth a little bit.

 

Christians, they are basically saying they would NOT have saved those people if they had Jesus' magic superhero powers....that's morally disturbing to sane people like you and I. I love them, but clearly the fanaticism that Jesus taught them is interfering with their moral abilities. Jesus is a terrible influence on them, morally.

 

Did I miss the part where you said that you'd have helped them?
Richard Dawkins would have helped them, if he had Jesus' mutant X-men superpowers like the Bible basically claims.

 

No, because the point is to go to Heaven, not live for eternity on Earth.

If everyone always asked for saving when they were going to die then very few people would ever die.

The way someone dies is irrelevant.

 

Correct again.
Jesus is clearly NOT messing with your head, and I admire you for that.
Yes, the reason he doesn't is because he's not really omnipotent and loving, as the Bible states.....so of course the Bible is a lie....just like it lied about a talking donkey, a man living in a fish for 3 days (yes, days), etc.

 

By that answer, thank you for helping me at least show on this thread the moral difference between Modern Secular Humanists and religious people.

Jesus, if you existed, you'd know what his reply would be, and I hope you'd be ashamed of yourself for instilling a lack of compassion in your followers like this....your followers are prioritizing submission and fear of you over being moral people and saving innocent lives in the face of pure evil. Shame on you, Jesus.

 

I will try one more time: This time I'll try to make it very simple and I hope you will be able to follow the answer to your posed question.

Your focus on your moral superiority complex is completely irrelevant to the answer of the OP. The questions of the OP are obviously directed for you to confirm to yourself (and to others) how moraly superior you are to religious people, however the real question in the OP is directed towards theists and their interpretation of the matter and how to justify that within their Christian beliefs. In other words: How can the moral dilemma be justified within the boundaries of a Christian religion. Therefore the answer has to be found within the boundary of the religion, and therefore the answer is "free will". This topic is therefore not a question of morality, which I see you want it to be. The premise of morality can be destroyed by pointing out "free will" within religious boundaries. Hence, theists won't initiate in the way you want to and you won't achieve a single thing, but to point out your complex...

 

So the only way for Jesus to be moral would be for Him to save everyone that asked who was near death?

That is one hell of a get out of jail free card isn't it?

There are many better ways to hit on religion without stuff like this you know.

 

Ahhhh, NOW we see why Jesus lets innocent little children die absolute horrifically painful deaths due to childhood cancers - when he could simply snap his allegedly all-powerful fingers and just give us the cure once and for all. In other words, Jesus doesn't really care about our well being at all - no wonder that meta studies show that prayer is ineffective, especially intercessory prayer.

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I'm glad you and Jesus are not in charge of life/death decisions for me and my family. Thank Zeus for that!

 

Jesus never said He would save anyone.........this is what He said...........“I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live.” (John 11:25).

 

If "free will" exists, and Jesus won't interfere with it, then he doesn't answer much of the prayers that people make, it can be argued.

 

Prayer is not about asking for things and getting them, they are about simply talking with God.

I am shocked at how many of you unbelievers do not know this simple fact.

 

If I believe in science, and not magic (walking on water, reviving the dead through his magic, etc.) then according to John 14:6 I don't get to "heaven" - and I deserve horrific torture - worse than the Auschwitz inmates had it, arguably. That doesn't seem fair, when he allegedly gave us science in the first place. Apparently this god/Jesus bloke is not into fairness.

 

Being a Christian is not about taking the Bible literally, its about your daily walk with God.

 

"Ask and it will be given to you", Mt 7:7.
http://biblehub.com/niv/matthew/7.htm
Apparently Jesus didn't get the memo.

 

Too bad we can't take the invisible friend at his word.
Too bad he doesn't mean what he says, and says what he means.
Too bad he have to split hairs and perform interpretive apologistic acrobatics because he's such a lousy communicator.
Too bad we can't trust his word.

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A daily delusion?