"Atheism Produces Evil on Incredible Levels"

Dear Herr Gemlich,

If the threat with which Jewry faces our people has given rise to undeniable hostility on the part of a large section of our people, the cause of this hostility must be sought in the clear recognition that Jewry as such is deliberately or unwittingly having a pernicious effect on our nation, but mostly in personal intercourse, in the poor impression the Jew makes as an individual. As a result, antisemitism far too readily assumes a purely emotional character. But this is not the correct response. Antisemitism as a political movement may not and cannot be molded by emotional factors but only by recognition of the facts. Now the facts are these:

To begin with, the Jews are unquestionably a race, not a religious community. The Jew himself never describes himself as a Jewish German, a Jewish Pole or a Jewish American, but always as a German, Polish or American Jew. Jews have never adopted more than the language of the foreign nations in whose midst they live. A German who is forced to make use of the French language in France, Italian in Italy, Chinese in China does not thereby become a Frenchman, Italian, or Chinaman, nor can we call a Jew who happens to live amongst us and who is therefore forced to use the German language, a German. Neither does the Mosaic faith, however great its importance for the preservation of that race, be the sole criterion for deciding who is a Jew and who is not. There is hardly a race in the world whose members all belong to a single religion.

Through inbreeding for thousands of years, often in very small circles, the Jew has been able to preserve his race and his racial characteristics much more successfully than most of the numerous people among whom he has lived. As a result there lives amongst us a non-German, alien race, unwilling and indeed unable to shed its racial characteristics, its particular feelings, thoughts and ambitions and nevertheless enjoying the same political rights as we ourselves do. And since even the Jew's feelings are limited to the purely material realm, his thoughts and ambitions are bound to be so even more strongly. Their dance around the golden calf becomes a ruthless struggle for all the possessions that we feel deep down are not the highest and not the only ones worth striving for on this earth.

The value of an individual is no longer determined by his character or by the significance of his achievements for the community, but solely by the size of his fortune, his wealth.

The greatness of a nation is no longer measured by the sum of its moral and spiritual resources, but only by the wealth of its material possessions.

All this results in that mental attitude and that quest for money and the power to protect it which allow the Jew to become so unscrupulous in his choice of means, so merciless in their use of his own ends. In autocratic states he cringes before the 'majesty' of the princes and misuses their favors to become a leech on their people.

In democracies he vies for the favor of the masses, cringes before 'the majesty of the people', but only recognizes the majesty of money.

He saps the prince's character with Byzantine flattery; national pride and the strength of the nation with ridicule and shameless seduction to vice. His method of battle is that public opinion which is never expressed in the press but which is nonetheless manages and falsified by it. His power is the power of the money, which multiplies in his hands effortlessly and endlessly through interest, and with which he imposes a yoke upon the nation that is the more pernicious in that its glitter disguises its ultimately tragic consequences. Everything that makes the people strive for higher goals, be it religion, socialism, or democracy, is to the Jew merely a means to an end, the way to satisfy his greed and thirst for power.

The results of his works is racial tuberculosis of the nation.

And this has the following consequences: purely emotional antisemitism finds its final expression in the form of pogroms. Rational antisemitism, by contrast, must lead to a systematic and legal struggle against, and eradication of, the privileges the Jews enjoy over the other foreigners living among us (Alien Laws). Its final objective, however, must be the total removal of all Jews from our midst. Both objectives can only be achieved by a government of national strength and not one of national impotence.

The German Republic owes its birth not the united national will of our people, but to the underhand exploitation of a series of circumstances that, taken together, express themselves in a deep, universal dissatisfaction. These circumstances, however, arose independently of the political structure and are at work even today. Indeed, more so than ever before. Hence, a large part of our people recognizes that changing the structure of the state cannot in itself improve our position, but that this can only be achieved by the rebirth of the nation's moral and spiritual forces.

And this rebirth cannot be prepared by the leadership of an irresponsibly majority influence by party dogmas or by the internationalist catch-phrases and slogans of an irresponsible press, but only by determined acts on the part of nationally minded leadership with an inner sense of responsibility.

This very fact serves to deprive the Republic of the inner support of the spiritual forces any nation needs very badly. Hence the present leaders of the nation are forced to seek support from those who alone have benefited and continue to benefit from changing the form of the German state, and who for that very reason become the driving force of the Revolution -- the Jews. Disregarding the Jewish threat, which is undoubtedly recognized even by today's leaders (as various statement from prominent personalities reveal), these men are forced to accept Jewish favors to their private advantage and to repay these favors. And the repayment does not merely involve satisfying every possible Jewish demand, but above all preventing the struggle of the betrayed people against its defrauders, by sabotaging the antisemitic movement.

Yours truly,
Adolf Hitler

 

Well, in case you haven't realized, secular nations in the 20th century is the topic of discussion.


- - - Updated - - -

Umm... Says common sense?

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_sharpshooter_fallacy

 

No. Christians believe in objective morality. They believe that things are evil no matter what someone's opinions are. Christians believe that God is the reference point of objective morality.

ROFLMAO

Hitler was an apostate and threw away religion when he was 15 years old. He's been an atheist for the rest of his life since then.

Look, the whole point of this conversation was to show that, if an atheist wanted to kill someone and they knew they could get away with it without any sort of consequences, their morality wouldn't be what would stop them from doing the act. Well, many atheist warlords felt the same way and killed millions upon millions of people. That is why they are the topic of discussion.


- - - Updated - - -

Fallacy this and fallacy that. You're right about the blog thing, and I therefore provided more sources, yet you keep harboring on that point.


Anyway, I'm leaving the forum. A ton of you are flagging my posts and making the mods go nuts. So, I will leave, just like you guys want me to. Great debates, I might add. Many of them I truly enjoyed. I'll be watching my private messages, so if any of you wanna get out some last words, you can send them privately.

Ciao!

 

Honestly, good riddance. If you had shown any amount of decency, humility, or earnest interest in having a debate then I would bemoan your departure. But you didn't. Hypocrisy, hubris, irrationality, and troll-like behavior is all we got out of you.

 

He was never excommunicated, therefore remained a Catholic. Possibly a bad Catholic, but a Catholic nevertheless.

 

Some Christians believe that gay marriage is immoral, other's believe it is moral. Some Christians are pro-choice, others are pro-life. You see, you camp is composed of over 3,600 denominations. You can pretend that moral subjectivity and relativism does not exist, and continue to delude yourself, but that is not based in fact or reality.

Nope.

I have two pages of quotes that show you are completely and demonstrably wrong.

Rape your mom and kill your siblings, mummer some words on your deathbed, and you are saved.

What incentive is there to be good if you go to heaven either way? LOL

 

In case you didn't know it a secular nation doesn't mean that nation is communist. Some countries in Europe are secular states and are certainly not communist. The EU is a secular organisation.

Perhaps you should read Phil Zuckerman Ph.D. He even shows how some of the many religious states in the US have a worse 'quality of life' that many of the less religious states. I quote this statement from his article

'If you are curious as to which states are the most/least religious, simply check out the Pew Forum’s Religious Landscape Survey. It’s all there. And then you can go ahead and check out how the various states are faring in terms of societal well-being. The correlation is clear and strong: the more secular tend to fare better than the more religious on a vast host of measures, including homicide and violent crime rates, poverty rates, obesity and diabetes rates, child abuse rates, educational attainment levels, income levels, unemployment rates, rates of sexually transmitted diseases and teen pregnancy, etc. You name it: on nearly every sociological measure of well-being, you’re most likely to find the more secular states with the lowest levels of faith in God and the lowest rates of church attendance faring the best and the most religious states with the highest levels of faith in God and rates of church attendance faring the worst.'

 

The above bolded statement got me sent to the too smart for me bin. And he never did answer me why there are so many version of Christianity, if they all believed the exact same moral values and thoughts.
He even goes on to argue Paul and Jesus are in contradiction, one preaches faith alone, one preaches faith with good works.

Welcome to the club.

 

Not according to Your Very Own OP.
Perhaps you should read what you post.

 

But there are so many gods. How does one know which one to believe? For each of the various believers in their god, feels just like you do with you god. They are all just as serious as you are, So who has the right god? It would be helpful if the right god would just come on down and reveal himself to all of humanity, so that we would know which one is the right god. But alas, he will not do that. So we are back where we started. We believe in the god of our culture the one we were conditioned to believe in. And the next culture does the exact same.

So if facts matter, and they should, that is the fact of the matter. So what should man do? Perhaps we should stop believing in any god until he can take the time out of his busy day and let us know, all of humanity, once and for all.

 

And he will not address the question. It is easier to image that all Christians believe the same thing, even if they don't believe the same thing.

 

The reason is that Christian should all be awaiting the messiah they expect, because they show the Bible needs explanations since they all differ.

The messiah is the one guy who will open the closed book for these believers:

Rev 5:2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof?
And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon.

- - - Updated - - -

But having faith in Truth is still wise, isn't?

 

It was all prophesied in the Bible, and had to happen...
Had the Jews understood and read Revelation they could have avoided what was coming.

 

Do you know how many events have been paralleled with Revelation? I've never heard of the Holocaust link with Revelation, though...

 

I would personally love too see these quotes you have, hitler was not an atheist

 

Christians believe in approximately 3500 different formal moralities, and a couple of billion different 'personal interpretations' of same. No two Christians can agree one what morality is, let alone all of 'em. Clearly, your god is not the point of reference. Clearly, the individual is the point of reference. That's SUBJECTIVE morality, incidentally. Damn those shoelaces.

Yes, the only thing stopping atheists from murdering is those stupid laws. Because god knows, we all WANT to murder

Oh yeah, happy trails! Don't let the door hit you on the way out

 

repeated for Dave, and every other Christian here who insists that jesus makes things better. but mostly for Dave.

 

You wouldn't even dream of disagreeing with a Christian rant against atheists, no matter how grossly inaccurate it might be, would you? It suits your ideology and agenda, and so you run with it.

There's absolutely nothing about rejecting the existence of deities that makes a person less ethical or moral. Ethics and morals do not stem from deities; rather, people ascribe these qualities to their deities, creating non-existent ideal persons in the sky (or in the earth, or where ever they decide their deity lives/deities live). But why do people do this? That comes down to human psychology. Some feel the need for a high ideal to look up to and follow, and for many that means choosing, defining and worshiping a deity of some kind. It helps to be raised in this kind of thinking by parents and other elders, of course, so that it becomes conditioned.

 

or, at the VERY least, actually stop and think this through. then stop and consider if you're a) complacent, lazy, and sufficiently comfortable with falsehoods to accept whatever was spoon fed to you, or b) care enough about truth and your immortal soul to make damn sure you're not a).

further, since no one can know if any of the earth gods happens to be a high ranking god (as multiverses go), it's vanity of a very high order to imagine you've nailed it first go. or second go. or third, ad nauseum. which brings us back to your proposition.

 

It could be essential to the maintenance of their faith, in fact. confronting the reality must be quite unsettling.

 

?
What "fair way" do you suggest we examine atheistic societies vs religious societies???

Comparison seems fair and right IMHO.

 

Jesus preached both works and faith, and then, just faith alone.
A martyr in Islam today who retained his faith in Christ while they cut his head off is a good example for both situations.

John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

 

This one is hard to deny and impossible to replace with a better historical comparison:

Rev. 11:7 And when they, (the two candlesticks, i.e.; the House of Jacob and the House of Judah), shall have finished their testimony (in the 17th century, against their own messiah ben Joseph, and changed their written texts in the Talmud so as to remove the name of Jesus and their direct protests against him), the (seven headed) beast (of Western civilization) that (had) ascendeth out of the bottomless pit (in The Renaissance) shall make (secular) war against them, (these Jews of the diaspora), and shall overcome them (in 1942), and kill them (with gas and starvation and brutalities).

Rev. 11:8 And, (the House of Jacob and the house of Judah), their dead bodies shall lie in the street (of Nazi Paganism) of the great city (which is the tenth horn of Western Civilization), which spiritually (in its philosophical outlook) is called Sodom, (a place practicing pagan sexual license and libidinal excess, one to be destroyed by fire) and (that ancient place of Jew trust in the shadow of) Egypt, (the time of their confusion: [Isa. 30:2-3]: Egypt, the land of both their beloved Joseph and also, their slavery), where, (in their blindness of scriptural truth) also our Lord was crucified (among them in 32 AD).

Rev. 11:9 And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations (of the 1260 years of the Jewish dispersion among them, the Diaspora), shall not see their dead bodies to be put in graves (but in Concentration Camps) three days (of years) and an half, (i.e.; 1942-1945), and kill them (with gas and starvation and brutalities)

Rev. 11:10 And they that dwell upon the earth, (in Nazi Western Europe), shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send (supposed Christian seasonal) gifts one to another, (like the skin of Jews for lampshades, etc); because these two prophets, (the House of Jacob and the House of Judah, the two candlesticks: [Rev 11:4]), tormented them that dwelt on the earth.

Rev. 11:11 And after (the Holocaust), three and an half days (of years, 1942-1945), the Spirit of life from God entered into them, (the House of Jacob and the House of Judah: [Rev 11:4]), and they stood upon their feet (in the land Promised); and great fear fell upon them (in Islam) which saw them, (the prophecy of the Fig Tree, blooming was fulfilled: [Matt 24:32).

Rev. 11:12 And (the survivors), they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither (where all Nations can see). And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud (of history); and their enemies (especially in Palestinia) beheld them.

Rev. 11:13 And the same hour was there a great "earthquake," (i.e.; Israeli Statehood!!), and the tenth part of the city, (the Promised Land), fell (to the returning Jews), and in the "earthquake" (of their in-gathering) were slain of (muslim) men, seven thousand: and the remnant (Islamic armies) were affrighted, and (all the Judaeo-Christian world) gave glory to the God of heaven (that prophecy had been fulfilled).

 

And not 1 mention of who this messiah is. If it has come yet. If it will ever come.
Smoke and mirrors. And you very own personal out of this world interpretation.

- - - Updated - - -

Oh. But revelations wasn't even written for 100's of years later.
Dang, they all needed to be prophets to know what would be written so many centuries later. LOL.