Can Muslims Ever Be Trusted ? (asked of non-Muslims)

Sometimes Muslims apply for jobs. Sometimes they enroll in schools. They may even ask to become engaged to somebody. In all these cases, can non-Muslims ever feel confident that the Muslim people who are asking for their trust, will not betray that trust ?

Can a non-Muslim woman ever be secure that her possible future Muslim husband won't beat her ? (in accordance with Koran 4:34). Can she be secure that he won't molest her children ? (as Mo the Pedophile did with his many pre-pubescent wives, and as the Koran gives the green light to).

How about going to work for Muslims in their homes (as maids, butlers, landscapers, etc). Can one be sure they won't be kidnapped and made slaves ? (as Mohammed did, and as the Koran OKs).

What about theft ? Doesn't the Koran say it's OK to rob, as long as the victims are not Muslims ?

And, in fact, doesn't Islam really OK anything to be done to people as long as they are "infidels" ? Like when Muslim leaders often say "We are opposed to violence against innocent people" - but they conveniently leave out the part that, to them, only Muslims qualify to be called "innocent people", non-Muslims (especially Israelis & Americans) don't. Add gays to that.

And if you gave money to a Muslim "charity", could you be secure to think that your money will really go to help poor people, and not to fund terrorists ? The 2008 US vs. Holy Land Foundation trial showed that sometimes Muslim groups send money to terrorist organizations, while pretending to be benefactors of charities.

And how about like when CAIR leaders are asked > "do you oppose Hamas ?" (which of course they don't). They say > "We oppose all terrorism", without stipulating if they define Hamas as terrorists (which of course they don't). Taqiyya is alive and well at CAIR.

And how about the allegiance to the nation they live in ? Can a true Muslim ever be loyal to any nation ? In the USA, some alleged Muslims have gone to war wearing the USA military uniform and lost their lives. They are heros to their nation as well as anyone. But by doing so, they proved that they were not real Muslim, they were real Americans, and can anyone be both of those things ? Scholars from many countries who have studied Islam, have repeatedly concluded that the true Muslim does not even recognize the existence of nations, let alone be loyal to one. To them, there is only one entity to grant their allegiance to > the Ummah (worldwide community of Muslims). For example, a so-called American Muslim would have more allegiance to a Muslim in Albania than a non-Muslim American. A Canadian Muslim may likely find more kinship to another Muslim in South Africa than a non-Muslim Canadian, and so on.

In November 2009, a US army officer, Major Nidal Hasan was trusted by his fellow officers (or they engaged in excessive political correctness, AKA Muslim ass-kissing). This despite numerous reports that Hasan had Email connections to the late Anwar al-Awlaki, an al Qaeda operative in Yemen.
Huge MISTAKE. It resulted in 13 counts of premeditated murder, and 32 counts of attempted murder of his fellow US troops. The source of this mass murder ? The Koran.

Counterterrorist officials concur unanimously that every time one of these jihadist screwballs is caught trying to kill people, the source of the attack is consistent > the Koran and jihadist leadership.

Lastly, it may be noted that there is a huge understanding gap between Westerners and Muslims. Westerners (like President Obama) want everyone to be friends. Nice wish. But can it apply to Muslims ? Many people who have researched this say NO it CANNOT. Worse yet, in many (if not most) instances Muslims consider themselves to be in a constant state of war against non-Muslims, and therefore look upon these friendly overtures to them as just weakness, rather than friendship. (ex. Obama & Iran)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nidal_Malik_Hasan

 

Islam will soon be the worlds largest religion. It has over a billion people who follow it.
If every muslim was what you percieve them to be, than the west would have been gone long ago.
furthermore, you clearly no nothing about Islam, I've read the Qur'an. They do not believe you can do anything to an 'infidel', furthermore Islam is not a nation, it is a religion that believes in the same God christians do. it follows the same morals, the difference is that Islamic people are far more devout and that middle eastern culture has been incorporated into it (the burkha for example is largely a cultural practice that many Islamic fundamentalists have wrongly percieved to be part of their religion).
Perhaps, because I am not an american, I can not understand your overall nationcentric view. I believe it is worthy of note to you that Islamic militants and terrorists have killed a LOT more russians than they have americans (both in afghanistan and chechnya).
Furthermore, I believe that you should revise your opinion if you looked at the real reason that terrorists target the USA, Iraqi militants and the Taliban both fought against america only after their nation was invaded your military. yes they had ties to Al Qaeda, but they also had ties to pakistan and the local populace of their nation.

 

The Quran says a lot of things, but then, so does the Bible.

Can we ever trust that a Christian won't kill someone because they are gay? Can we trust that a Christian won't rape a woman and then marry her? Etc etc.

Just change the religion and reword your OP.

 

HA HA.. 1. You're going to tell me all about...and you don't even know how to spell the word "know". First requirement for posting in a forum is to know how to spell simple words.

2. No, Islam will not be the world's largest religion, because it isn't a "religion", it is a political ideology that's been masquerading as a religion fro 1400 years for an obvious reason. If you don't what that reasons is, i will explain it to you.

3. The West could be gone, as a result of Muslim genocide, easily without every Muslim being what I say Muslims are. It only take a few Muslims to destroy a dozen major cities with nuclear or biological bombs. Also, by way of the non-violent jihadists (Muslim Brotherhood) the West could be gone as a result of their total domination goal + the high degree of organization + their high level of financing + the tendency of western politicians to kiss ass to whomever represents a voting bloc. Population isn't too relevant.

4. I've read the Koran in 5 different translations - it tells Muslims to kill infidels. It tells husbands to beat their wives. It OKs kidnapping/slavery, pedophilia, misogyny, robbery, rape, animal cruelty (Eid al-Adha), torture, mutilation, and other terrible things. It is the worst, most vile piece of filth that's ever been written.

5. Whether Muslim cultural practices are directly from the Koran matters little to Americans. Simple fact is, we want no part of their uncivilized, barbaric cultural practices, Koran or not.

6. It is NOT worthy of note to me that Islamic militants and terrorists have killed a LOT more Russians than they have Americans, because I have stated in Political Forum many times that they have killed 270 million people around the world. (120 million Africans, 80 million Hindus, 60 million Christians, and 10 million Buddhists).

7. I supposed al Qaeda has considered the Desert Storm thing, but they still rely on the Koran and its commands of jihad, and this had been confirmed from every terrorist that has been caught and questioned. Also, the Stealth Jihad of the Muslim Brotherhood, has nothing to do with Desert Storm or any US invasions. They have been in operation since 1928, and their goal has never changed - a world Islamic caliphate.

8. Lastly, you are a Muslim, correct ?

 

I've noticed that the only ones who slam Christians are Muslims. Yeah, we could trust that Christians won't rape a woman. With Muslims however, there is a question mark there. There is ample evidence for rape (explicitly) and gang-rape in the Koran. Further, Mohammed justifies this rape as being acceptable to Allah. Further, Mohammed claims for himself or claims that Allah granted him the use of not only his own wives, but also those captured in battle, and his cousins as well. Essentially there was no woman who he could not rape or force himself on. Quite amazing that this subhuman trashbag, who spawned so much hate and war and human misery, is actually looked upon by Muslims as the perfect person. He's probably the least perfect person that ever lived.

"there is not a single verse in the Qur'an which even remotely discourages forced sex. In contrast, there are several verses in this book which give the green light to rape and other sexual crimes against women." (http://wikiislam.net/wiki/Rape_in_Islam)

 

1- you quite obviously are in need of a reality check. Islam is a religion, people worship and pray to Allah, they fast at Ramadan, they go on pilgrimages to Mecca. Sounds like religious practices to me. And yes it influences politics in nations with large amounts of Islamic people, but the same goes for nations with large amounts of any other religious belief.
2- The fact is that such a future will never happen, its politically inconvievable that Illiterate Islamic fundamentalists will overtake the west in technological and economic strength, some middle eastern countries may, but no insurgency will ever have that strength
3- Bull(*)(*)(*)(*)
4-Tone down the racism
5- When did all these people die? please provide some links
6- Al Qaeda was formed in the 1990s by Osama Bin Laden
7- I am not Muslim, I am Taoist.
And lastly, before you criticise me on my spelling, maybe you should spell the Qur'an correctly,(seriously koran?)

 

How is the current use of Islam (and pick your sect, there are quite a few) as a rallying cry against foreign invaders any different from the usage of Chrisitianity during the conquest of the western hemispehere?

Religion has often been misused by the powerful to get the ignorant masses to do what the powerful wants to get done. This is nothing new, nor anything strictly Islamic in any way. Again, my own Christian history will show you that. Islam is just the latest in a long string of misused religions.

There are distinct and dangerous threats posed by some of the powers that be in the Muslim world . . . but they absolutely pale in comparison to the destruction we are truly capable of inflicting on them should we ever decide we've had enough.

A city here, a city there, and perhaps a few tens of millions of deaths, at the outside, by biological warfare. No where near what we could do to them. You can sleep easy there. While they can hurt us, they can not destroy us. Militarily, the entire Muslim world combined poses no existential threat to us.

That would be up to us giving away our rights. Are you ready to do that? Neither am I. And I doubt anyone else in the West is willing to submit themselves to becoming a Muslim nation. That's a choice the people have to make. I don't see it happening any time soon.

Ever read the Old Testament? We Christians have our past, too, you know. Slavery, murder, rape and all the like are in there, too, along with razing entire cities while killing every man, woman and child there to purify the land. Nasty business.

Christians have learned (well most of us, anyway--there are certainly exceptions) what the Islamic militants have yet to learn--it's better to have willing followers who chose to believe in God over forcing them to say and do what we want in public and practice what they beleive in private. Tends to lead to ugly little rebellions and things we'd rather not live and learn through again.

So don't convert. Pretty simple there. And you really need to read up on what moderate Muslims believe. The take you have is . . . well, not one that is practiced widely in the States.

Here's one I agree with. I don't care how many Americans Muslims have killed in their quest for power / revenge / economic parity / whatever. One is too many. And they should be heavily punished for it.

Which they never managed to pull of without the US driving them back into their own end of the planet. What chance do they have now? Give them their corner. Crush them any time they decide to come out and play "kill the infidel."

We clearly have proven we can go into any nation at any time we so choose. There should be no doubt as to the fact we can do so again. I am in no way worried about them dong anything more here than another 9/11 style attack. Bad enough, to be sure, but nothing even close to what it would take to do more than (*)(*)(*)(*) us off. Ten years of sustained warfare and dismantling their nations should have taught them by now how well that works for them.

No, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night.

 

1. Here's YOUR reality check. It's obvious how Islam came to be purported as a "religion". When the founders of it were expousing imperialist genocidal mass murder, extreme misogyny, pedophilia, kidnapping/slavery, torture/mutilation, racial and sexist discrimination, and other vile things, and were looking for troops to join them in their conquests throughout Asia Minor, they needed something very powerful and extreme to offset and shield them from the severe condemnation they were sure to get.
The answer was religion. By pretending that the Koran, and all of its hatred and immorality was the word of God, they forced the people to accept it. After all, nobody wants to go against God do they ? As this grandiose con job spread, over time it became deeper and deeper entrenched as a religion, and more and more difficult to abolish or reform. Especially when Muslims were killing 270 million people around the world for resisting it.

http://avideditor.wordpress.com/200...ion-nor-is-it-a-cult-it-is-a-complete-system/

http://blogs.ssrc.org/tif/2010/07/28/islam-not-a-religion/

http://www.halfsigma.com/2011/01/islam-not-a-religion.html

2. "Illiterate" Islamic fundamentalists. Illiterate doesn't matter much either. Mohammed was an illiterate/ Look at the 1400 year abomination he spawned. And as I said the Muslim Brotherhood is very capable, especially if they are not resisted by airheaded politically correct Muslim ass-kisser and politician vote panderers.

3. Bull(*)(*)(*)(*) ? I accept the challenge (however lamebrain it is) - here's 2 examples of one of the things I mentioned >

"It tells husbands to beat their wives." ("Men have authority over women because God has made the one superior to the other, and because they spend their wealth to maintain them. Good women are obedient. They guard their unseen parts because God has guarded them. As for those from whom you fear disobedience, admonish them and forsake them in beds apart, and beat them." - Koran 4:34, "Women," Dawood, p. 83.) Same thing is said in 4 other translations.

"it tells Muslims to kill infidels" - ("I shall cast terror into the hearts of the infidels. Strike off their heads, strike off the very tips of their fingers." - Koran 8:12, "The Spoils," Dawood, p. 177)
"When the sacred months are over slay the idolaters wherever you find them. Arrest them, besiege them, and lie in ambush everywhere for them." - Koran 9:5; "Repentance," Dawood, p. 186

 

4. I don't need to tone down anything. Islam is not a race. And practitioners of its ideology, are just what I said they are > uncivilized, barbaric savages. Nothing less.

5. Here is 6,870,000 links pertaining to the infamous 270 million murder victims of Muslim marauders over the past 1400 years. Lots to pick from.

http://www.google.com/#hl=en&sugexp...w.,cf.osb&fp=a4183349b9a276ea&biw=837&bih=492

6. I don't care when al Qaeda was formed.

7. You escape blame by having said "maybe" I should spell the Koran right. The "maybe" indicates you weren't sure. Now you can be sure - the Koran can be spelled either of these 2 ways. Both are considered acceptable in American literary practice. No other genre means anything to me.

PS - In the Webster's New World College Dictionary (4th ed.) it is listed as "Koran" with this definition - the sacred book of Islam; In Muslim belief, it contains revelations made to Mohammed by Allah.
It is also listed as "Qu-ran or Qur'an" with this definition - Koran.

 

The conquest of the western hemispehere was done for wealth and patriotism, not Christianity, nor was Christianity a rallying cry from anyone except missionaries, who had little do do with conquering - they simply introduced Catholicism

Islam is not a religion.

No they don't. Muslims could wipe out the whole population of North America with well-planned attacks of nuclear and biological weapons.

FALSE and ridiculous. You sound like an Islamist. I asked for only non- Muslims to respond in this thread.

You are revealing your ignorance. It has BEEN HAPPENING for 20 years now in America (since the May 1991 Explanatory Memorandum), and for 30 years in Europe, since the December 1982 Project). Since then, thousands of instances of Islamization (AKA Stealth Jihad), with us giving away our rights, have been occuring routinely. Where have you been ? In a closet ? Many of the factual real-life occurances are reported in these books and theier thousands of footnoted reports (many of them US Government documents) :


1. They Must Be Stopped by Brigitte Gabriel

2. The Politically Incorrect Guide to Islam (and the Crusades) by Robert Spencer

3. Stealth Jihad by Robert Spencer

4. Infiltration by Paul Sperry

5. The Day of Islam by Dr. Paul Williams

6. Sharia: the Threat to America by the Center for Security Policy

7. The Third Jihad (DVD) by Dr. Zuddhi Jasser

8. Muslim Mafia by P.David Gaubatz & Paul Sperry

You said it clear. Christians have their PAST (misdeeds). Going back hundreds of years. But theirs was never anything close in magnitude to the record of Islam, and the Muslims are still doing it NOW.

Do you know how many Muslims husbands practice sura 4:34 (telling them to beat their wives) inside their bedrooms ? If not how can you make the statement > "not one that is practiced widely in the States."
Likewise with pedophilia, animal cruelty on Eid al-Adha, et al.

Yeah ? So tell us where Shukrijumah and his nuclear "toys" are right now ? And how anyone is going to crush him if/whenever he decides to kill the infidel ?

Have you read The Day of Islam by Dr. Paul Williams ? It doesn't sound like it. Read it first chance you get.

A Holiday Inn in Karachi ?

 

First off. the whole brutality depicted in the Qur'an is nothing particularly special or worrying, the Bible is just as bad. saying all muslims actually believe and follow obscure pieces of it is foolish. how many christians think gays need to be executed? how many believe disobediant children need to be executed? only a severe minority. same goes for Islam.
On the topic of those deaths. I really couldn't care less who was killed by muslims 1000 years ago, most of those deaths are as politically relevant as the fuedal system of government.
Also, 'simply introduced Catholicism' is a pretty odd comment, there were wars you know.
also, your sources are biased, try reading both the pro-Islam and anti-Islam political views. Its what I do on every political issue (I check both sides). you seem to be intent on hating muslims, I honestly don't understand why you asked whether they can be trusted. seeing as you clearly don't, and everyone who has replied has at least said the moderate ones can be trusted and you STILL refuse to look at Islam differently. Why ask a question if you won't listen to everyone's answer?

 

NAh. Nothing special. Just responsible for 270 million dead people around the world, for 1400 years, no big deal. 17,000+ terrorist attacks since 9/11, no big deal. Obscure pieces of the Koran ? How can any part of the Koran be "obscure". All parts of the Koran are equally visible and equally regarded as the word of Allah.

Disobedient childred need to be executed ? Wow. In all my years of extensive research on the perversion of Islam I hadn't heard that one before. You guys are even more nutcake than I thought. Sheeesh.

And oh, my sources are biased, huh ? HA HA HA! Like we haven't heard that before. No, just about 2 dozen times every day. So you got some evidence to show about biased sources ? That would be interesting. Let's hear it.

 

Muslims are fine until they become the majority. Then they insist on changes that alter things like free speech. Here's what happens when a country has a Muslim majority:


[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8J_cqtdH26c&feature=youtube_gdata"]EXECUTION - Islam murders a young mother! - YouTube[/ame]

 

Every person is an individual. Judging them on their religion is weak. Who have you met who is muslim and who you cannot trust? Is your distrust based solely on their religion?

 

LMAO... I think you just literally individually named everybody in this thread a Muslim because they disagree with you...

 

I trust them just fine.... as long as Muslims are kept in check in some country by a murderous dictator and I don't have to live with them.

 

Isn't the real question -

'Who is more susceptible to brainwashing and propaganda?'

 

That hasn't happened though. That can only mean that either you're wrong about their ability or they (at least the vast majority) don't actually want to do it.

 

It could also be both.

 

Until we no longer read about "Muslims" murdering, coercing or terrorizing I would say no.

Until so-called peaceful Muslims publicly reject tenants of Islam which support mysoginist activities and Islamic theocracies reject and punish "honor crimes" I would say no.

As Islam currenlty exists I would push for legislation to label it a terrorist organization and throw these people out of our country.

 

Before Margot and her lying band of Muslim apologists come railing at me - this vid is a perfect example of why I feel as I do.

 

So much for free speech in the USA.

Perhaps it should be 'free speech as long as you agree with me' free speech.

 

Whose speech am I infringing?

 

It must really upset people like you that the sentence has not been carried out.

 

Perhaps you don't consider insulting somebody for what they write as an infringement to free speech. Perhaps I should have written 'the abuse of the right of free speech' which would have been more accurate.