Nothing to debate. For us it's a reality, for you all it's not. So when you have faith in something like the sun is going to shine tomorrow this is not reasoning?
For the wise are but fools. 'Tis laughable that the creation should tell the Creator the why and how to create. Yet, there is hope for you.
The point being: You don't know what's the point of an appendix. I don't know what's the point of an appendix. You haven't figured out the universe, I haven't figured out the universe, Einstein has not figured out the universe, in all likelihood no human being will ever figure out the universe and how every little thing in it works. But God has. Believing in Him or not remains a matter of faith of course. There is no point for theists and atheists in discussing the question whether He exists or not, let alone how He works, because it's outside the realm of human logic.
Like I said, for those of us who live in the rational world... That is not faith, it is scientific fact based on repeatable observation.
Ok, that's fine. I'm just traveling through. I happen to have a leg in the spiritual realm as well. Call it a 6th sense.
I've always been one to think that since there was never evidence to show that there is a God, I simply didn't want to believe anything after I began to uncover that there truly was no evidence of his existence. I lean more Agnostic, but I know of no evidence that proves that God doesn't exist, so I couldn't say anything for sure either way.
Fair enough. But until we can actually prove gods exist -- and specifically a god named God, can we take its name off the money?
its a relic from an earlier stage of evolution - if there was a God who doesn't want people to suffer and die needlessly, we would no longer have it. OK - I don't want to argue agaisnt your faith. You may well feel that God is real - and thats fine - but as soon as people start arguing that it "makes sense" that there is a God you will face arguments to show that it doesn't. It doesn't matter to me whether there is a God or not - and if it matters to you, then basically, your "sense" that there is a God does not need to rely on explaining his role in the "real world." It is enough for you to feel that God exists.
Sure it's enough for me to have faith in His existence and I'm also sure that you can lead a good life without believing in His existence. As to the question on whether His existence makes sense or not: the whole point about God is that He makes sense where we can't see it. Of course I can't explain His role in the "real world". I'm not God, but merely human. Being human also entails that I just like you I will keep asking questions and trying to find explanations. And for me as a religious person it means that I'll keep on searching for God and at least try to scratch on the surface of the Sublime that I have living faith in but no knowledge of.
that is not the same as "making sense" but ... lets try for some common ground. I have, as I have become older, learnt to accept that some things "just are". A lot of these questions may eventually be answered by science, but some are in a less tangible realm - not that of God - but because we can't see the inner workings of other people's minds and can't ever be 100% sure what drives them, or because sometimes things really do happen by chance. and thats OK. you, as a religious person, also accept that some things "just are" - but in at least a number of cases you see it as God working in mysterious ways, God's grace, or God's will. other than that - there is probably not that much difference between us.
Well, in all cases I see it as God's mysterious ways. Science can reveal some of these ways, which I find amazing. I love it when scientists find out more stuff about this fascinating world I believe God created. And yes, I agree other than that I believe in God there's not much difference between us. Quite the contrary: judging by the posts of you that I read I must say that so far I agreed with most of your opinions on other topics.
OK - and I can accept that you put it ALL into the realm of God working in mysterious ways - and if I was inclined towards belief in God - I would probably see it the same. WRT other topics ... I am sure we can find a few other points to differ on ... sometime!
Think what you like, write what you like. But to conclude that there are not much difference between you and the naysayer is far from true. You have accepted the most wonderful free gift ever offerred to man, they have not. You will spend eternity one place, they another. You have the Holy Spirit indwelling you, they do not. You accept Jesus as your Savior, they do not. Your hope is in God, their's is in Man. No, Sister. Don't think there's not much difference. The only similiarity is that you're both human trying to live in a fallen world.
or maybe there is no god and all religion is meaningless.....My point is still stands. A religious person can't offer any solid proof that god exists. It is on their face alone that they beleive. And at the same time, since god is not a physical being, and does not exist in our physical plane, a non-religious person can't give proof that he does not exist. The belief in god is a matter of the faith of each person. And even if evidence of his non-existence were found, a truely faithful believer will not take it seriously, since faith is blind to all else.
These things I can agree with you DD. However it is not the religious person that needs to offer the solid proof. It is God Himself that has done this already. Though of course one would have to accept the Holy Bible as the Word of God to believe the verses. Caveat, all are born with the knowledge of God. "IN the beginning God created the heaven and the earth." [Genesis 1:1] "THE heavens declare the glory of God; and the firmament sheweth his handiwork." [Psalms 19:1] http://www.gospelway.com/god/evidences-creation.php God is spirit: http://www.gotquestions.org/God-physical-body.html "Faith is blind to all else"? Really? We live in this world, same as you. We experience all that you do. So how can we be blind to all else? I would suggest that it is those that only believe in the physical and in what our minds can comprehend and pooh pooh the spiritual component that is truly blind. http://smartfaithapologetics.org/is-faith-blind/
The story of Job is a great example of blind faith. God makes a deal with Lucifer to allow Lucifer to destroy Job's entire life. He kills his entire family, destorys his land and his entire way of life, and this is all done so that God can prove that Job will be faithful, even if God allows him to suffer for absolutely no reason. If that is no blind faith I don't know what is. Not everyone believes in a spiritual existence, by the way. So you should keep those types of claims for yourself and leave everyone else out of them. And yes, true faith is blind. Someone could hand you 100% proof that god does not exist, and you would disregard it on faith. That is the point of faith, is has to be blind. If it was not, than all of the evil and destruction that god allowed to happen would not be able to be tossed up to his "mysterious ways"
Is there any evidence that elfs don't exist? Prove that something does not, normally is impossible. And what you have to do is prove that. And to be valid must be falsable. Thing that religion is not. God is pure faith, no reason, no reason to believe in that. You can't prove in any way that I have in my house an invisible elephant, and also only detectable by me. You directly can't. And the logic tells that if you can't prove something. Then that is ignorable and there is no reason to think in that. So it doesn't exist.
The fact is, most atheists lean along with the fact that is something that could only be abnormally possible, therefore atheists and agnostics, such as myself, find that hard to believe in.
I remember we had a little discussion about who spends eternity where and who's to be the judge of that question before. And I still don't think that we as Christians have reason to be smug about having a supposedly safe ticket to heaven while others will go elsewhere. I believe in a merciful God and in a God who doesn't hold many sympathies for smug people being full of themselves and their own righteousness via deeds or faith. Luke 18:9-14:
