An Orthodox would interpret that in a completely different manner than a Roman Catholic. What do you make of the so-called Photian Schism? Or all the Saints recognized by the RC church who explicitly denounce the idea of Roman supremacy? "You are Peter (Big Rock), and on this rock (little rock; profession of faith) I shall build my church, and the gates of hell shall not prevail." The phrase, "the gates of hell shall not prevail" is misunderstood by the RC church. Does a gated city attack? No. In this analogy, Jesus meant that the "city gates of Hell" shall nor withstand the offensive attacks of the Church. The Church is on the OFFENSIVE, not the defensive as the RC would have you believe.
If you study history, then you would know the violent inquisitions (the ones people like to blame religion for) were those begun by monarchs (as defenders of faith) NOT the Church or popes, and were political tools, rather than religion fervor. The Papal Inquisitions were not scary at all--especially considering the time period: Yikes, man! Wearing a yellow cross for life! How horrifying!!! lol.
Ummm...no, not really... http://www.catholicnews.com/data/stories/cns/0706123.htm http://www.goarch.org/ourfaith/ourfaith8523 We must understand the universal primacy of the Roman Church similarly. Based on Christian Tradition, it is possible to affirm the validity of the church of Rome's claims of universal primacy. Orthodox theology, however, objects to the identification of this primacy as "supreme power" transforming Rome into the principium radix et origio of the unity of the Church and of the Church itself.[41] The Church from the first days of its existence undeniably possessed an ecumenical centre of unity and agreement. In the apostolic and Judaeo‑Christian period this centre was first the church of Jerusalem and later the church of Rome ‑ "presiding in agape" according to St Ignatios of Antioch.[42] For the Orthodox, the essence and the purpose of this primacy is to express and preserve the unity of the Church in faith and life; to express and preserve the unanimity of all churches; to keep them from isolating themselves into ecclesiastical provincialism, losing the catholicity, separating themselves from the unity of life. It means ultimately to assume the care, the sollicitudo of the churches so that each one of them can abide in that fullness which is always the whole of the Catholic tradition and not any one "part" of it. The idea of primacy thus excludes the idea of jurisdiction but implies that of an "order" of Church which does not subordinate one church to another, but which makes it possible for all churches to live together this life of all in each and of each in all.[43] In summary, Orthodoxy does not reject Roman primacy as such, but simply a particular way of understanding that primacy. Might I add, that “particular way of understanding” is how the “Roman” aspect of the Catholic Churches sees it. There is no disagreement on the “Roman” side. I think people should stop looking for things to disagree about since we are One Holy and Apostolic Church. That's what I think, anyway. The "gates of Hell" refers to any entrance into the underworld, or Sheol. It means there will be no prevailing of entrance into Hell through the Church founded on Jesus (the Cornerstone) through His earthly representative (Peter). And, speaking of Peter--there is no such distinction "big rock, little rock." Peter is the Greek translation of Simon bar Jonah's name as Jesus gave it him. Jesus called "Peter" "Kepha"--Aramaic for "rock" (or as Paul records it, "Cephas") and there is no "big/little" rock word in Aramaic. Jesus would have said, "You are Kepha, and on this kepha I will build my Church." Your misunderstanding comes from the fact there is no masculine form for the word "rock" and so to make it fit as a man's name, in Greek there SEEMS to be a distinction where there is none in reality.
Or with other words: A national christian church is losing Catholicity and degenerates to an instrument of spiritual slavery in the hands of the rich and mighty. [video=youtube;gP-DYiJfw6g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gP-DYiJfw6g[/video]
I agree with most of your thread. I truly hope Christians and the Jewish religion can unite one day, however I do not see how even with supernatural help, lol!!!! Seriously the birthpangs Jesus spoke of are on CNN or the BBC every day! World news sounds like a Hal Lindsey report . As the OT pointed out the pope resignd, The last pope to do that was Pope Gregory XII, who stepped down in 1415. I am a end time prophesy Christian and in seminary the biblical book (NT) revelations was my focus. So to my eyes end time pridictions looks to be falling into place . The ME is in turmoil. The EU looks to be dividing on cultural and economic grounds generally speaking the north is bailing out the south and the dividing line is struck along those nations. Germany (north) is leading a probably vain attempt to save Greece (south) as she has in the past. I believe the Antichrist will come from the south EU or outside to be fragmented EU offering the only means to save it....but that is another thread eh? When will the world Armies meet Megiddo ? Who knows? Jesus said in words to the effect (I am too lazy to look it up, lol) ; . (The day of the lord) will come like a thief in the night! But of that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, only the father in heaven (will know the time). We Christians may not know the exact time but Jesus did list a litany of things, 'birthpangs' saying when we see those things 'the end draws nay'. We have brought the end times upon ourselves. If like in the days on Noah and in the time of Sodom and Gomorra if humanity would have taken the teachings and words of Jesus to heart and practiced them Armageddon would not occur. In Noah’s day not five righteous non-wicked (I think the world was inhabited with wicked beings with corrupted DNA resulting in hybrid beings). In fact only one man, Noah, was "just" and perfect" and who "walked with God" (Gen. 6:9). So God wiped out the bad DNA and the vessels that carried it. Maybe we have at least a few good and perfect men these days? (fingers crosseed). Now we need another Noah! reva
First: That's nonsense - second: Nevertheless why do you hope this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AeVJ2wvPxDU
Well well, how can you call it nonsense and then ask a question about it? Lol! Ok I won't be too mean, um' if I answer I may incriminate myself. I am taking the fifth as not to flame anyone, especially my catholic friends. … Ok I will try to think of a nice way to phrase it. Of course it’s a form of established doctrine already out there..~ reva
God did not kill anyone or wiped out anyone - the people in Sodom and Gomorrha just simple did not [like to] hear what god said - Noah heard and did what god said. But I'm asking myselve something else: Was or is anyone in your familiy a Nazi? Are you a Nazi? Why do you speak about DNA in this context? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ovp7u51Rmts
EXCERPT >>>> <<<<<<<EXCERPT Ok to answer your question, I am sure you know there are many competing theories of eschatology. As for what happens to those people of other faiths during judgment as an Dispensational Premillennialist at least as far as the question is concerned tells us that all faiths will be converted to 'traditional Christianity' in Daniel's 70th week (tribulation -Zech.12:7-13:1). Additionally and with no support I speculate God will not reject the Jewish people or those of other ' Christ' or religions that embed Jesus in their teachings etc. However, that said, I feel historical prementilisism is more supported by scripture leading up to the trib and to the 'Judgment'. No I do not beleive the rapture will happen and I do think Christians will suffer along with everyone else during the events leading up to and while Armageddon is allowed to rage. reva
I'm not interested in theology - I have not problems with god - okay : maybe god has from time to time little problems with me - but that's his fault. I'm only his child. Whow - what a word. Sounds nerdy. What's the sense of such ideas? God loves everyone. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEt2XdN_TbQ
Ok the answer...Btw, I have include the descriptive paragraph from the search engine I use for reference so the reader can decide if they want to visit site. No, am not a Nazi nor is mom's named Helga. Nor is she the She Wolf of the SS (never mind) I am a mere hillbilly. My extended family on my dads side is French and my moms old world family is mostly Dutch a little Cherokee, as are a lot of people in these mountains. That makes me a mutant I suppose, but No german that I know of. BTW for the record I despise the Nazis and jewish haters. I do love my German friends. Anyway, God certainly did indeed destroy Sodom and Gomorrah. Just crack your bible open to unless you have a different bible than I ! Reference; Genesis 19 NIV - Sodom and Gomorrah Destroyed - The two - Bible ... www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Genesis+19&version... - Cached - Similar24 Then the Lord rained down burning sulfur on Sodom and Gomorrah ... 29 So when God destroyed the cities of the plain, he remembered Abraham, and he ... Sodom And Gomorrah - Why God Destroyed Sodom And Gomorrah christianity.about.com/od/.../a/Sodom-And-Gomorrah.htm - Cached - SimilarGod sent two angels, disguised as men, to destroy Sodom and Gomorrah. See why God's holiness demanded that Sodom and Gomorrah had to perish. ... Related Searches sodom and gomorrah wickedness pillar of salt scripture reference ... I do not want to influence anyones beliefs yours included with what may be false teachings. So know that all the reference material including the above are just my general personal beliefs. I suggest that anyone that is Christian curious just read their bible and draw your own conclusions. No preacher/teacher/PhD needed, at least in 099% of cases. Also, be aware that I do not vouch for any of the sites accuracy etc. I use books not the net for important stuff. I am just posting them to give the forum a general idea of what I believe without writing 20,000 pieces of font that few read, lol. So with all that in mind ; 9. Noah's Ark: Genesis 6 www.truthnet.org/Genesis/9-Genesis...6/Genesis-Chapter-6.htm - CachedHere God also shows His plan to salvage humanity through the line of Noah, the descendent of Seth. ... Now God would eliminate corrupt humanity and corrupt creation. ... laws allowing the cloning of Human and Animal DNA overwhelmingly .http://www.truthnet.org/Genesis/9-Genesis-Chapter-6/Genesis-Chapter-6.htm God Bless This Forum~ Reva
I am sure God can handle most problems, lol, look what he did with the Egyptian soldiers at the Red Sea! But I like you hated asking for hemp er...asking for help of any kind!!! (hemp lol a parapraxis aka Freudian slip ? I am using a lot of geek words cause you like them so much lol..) Seriously though , at least you are aware of your feelings. That is not easy to do, at least I didn’t know myself on a deep level for a long time. Knowing and admitting to ourselves everything good and bad is near impossible for most people like the before saved reva. ....ahhh'~ I digress! And digress a lot....Where was I? Oh; Yes, you are correct A lot of my christian friends when accepting Jesus in their lives say they 'got relgion' (ie were 'saved'). The truth is that God chooses us we do not choose him. Yeah, I agree (see above ie geek words) . I thought I had invented the concept until I got in college and found someone had beat me to it by more than a thousand years! Darby and other turn of the century preachers etc that study or preach the various versions of 'yes the rapture will occur/ no it wont' were teaching concepts that were being taught a thousand to thousands of years ago. Yes, however some Christians think Jews killed Jesus etc and have other beliefs that stink of hate, and by proxy suggests that God shares the love of hate. So I was providing scripture to show God loves the Jewish and other believers of faith. Actually he despises only one thing without fail; SIN, he cant even bear to look at sin* but God loves the sinner. * GOD'S WORD® Translation (©1995) Your (Gods) eyes are too pure to look at evil. You can't watch wickedness. Why do you keep watching treacherous people? Why are you silent when wicked people swallow those who are more righteous than they are? Peace be with you and this forum; John 20:21 reva
Helga? Why Helga? Aha And this is now your explanation why you used the word DNA - desoxyribonucleic acid - in a completly strange context and you are without any shame calling god a mass-murderer who did it the right way to wipe out "DNA" - although never someone found any historical argument for the real existance of Sodom and Gomorrha? What about if Noahs arch is now - what about if the flood is now? - Or what about if Noahs arch would be in the future? And in general : What would you say if god would wipe your "DNA" from this planet? I have also jewish ancestors - so my DNA seems to be correct because I survived the flood of the Nazis! But what's wrong with your DNA - your DNA could never survive any serios trying from anyone to be flooded away with some shots out of a military gun. And by the way: I had a little problems with god because of my jokes about theology. Theology is important - very important - I understand theology in the moment comparable with normative structures in physics. We should know what we are speaking about if we are using a word like "meter" for example. But now back to you: Who gives you any right to attack the Catholic Church with stupid comments about Jews only because the pope resigns? What's the name of your church and/or your christian denomination? Or is to be an antigerman Nazi who is misusing biological expressions in wrong contextes of the christian religon enough morality for an atheist like you? God bless the USA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTCuQ5FzhYg
This idiots tried to fight with their kind of tanks in a swamp area - such things happen if people don't like to hear warnings. No - I'm only frustrated and angry - that's okay. Everyone has always all chances - and more than only this: god is love. Slalom too - ah ... Salem ... Salam ... Shalom ... Got it: Shalom! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhV5DbT7lHY
Yes, and I am sure that by the time Peter was awarded the office of Pope, he would have had difficulty recognizing the new mind set of the Christian Church of that time period?! If you are interested in how Messianic Judaism and the Messianic Gentile Movement divided from Rabbinic Judaism and became increasingly anti-Semitic you may enjoy this discussion thread: http://www.politicalforum.com/middl...-expelled-judaea-after-bar-kochba-revolt.html
Heresy was a high crime in those days, and to squelch anti-Catholic beliefs (which was just quoting the truths in the scriptures) and these are but a couple of Foxe's documented killings in his History of Martyrs: and many more such examples performed by the 'priests' of the Romanist Church. Even if only 1/10th were valid as recorded in his book, it still would have been 10's of thousands. If anything, the Popes may have tried to appear above the fray and wink as 'others' did the dirty work of the church. You're not a Holocaust denier too are you?! EDIT: From: Estimates of the Number Killed by the Papacy in the Middle Ages and later David A. Plaisted © 2006 http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=5&sqi=2&ved=0CEwQFjAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cs.unc.edu%2F~plaisted%2Festimates.doc&ei=Y6QbUcuOMabRiwLHwICICA&usg=AFQjCNEAlIKeb6ADhZR_D8_uLIhP-GwtMA&sig2=qPY6FXWHvP2aM5_u1nmxMA&bvm=bv.42261806,d.cGE&cad=rja
I'm telling you (I know that it is not the first time) that "Romanist" is a rude thing to say. Say "Church of Rome" or "Latin Rite" or your continued use of the term is purposefully derogatory. Second, a "priest" is not the Roman Church just as a senator is not the United States government. In your bigoted opinion. Really? I thought you had a tad more class. BTW: "Popery" is also derogatory. And SERIOUSLY? Are you seriously offering that at a source?
My problem with the 'Roman Catholic Church' is that they proclaim to be the one and only true Holy church*, altho they have over 1000 yrs of history showing corruptness, selling forgiveness (indulgences..which in the 50's were still mentioned in the Missal), and the gamut of sins relating to power, etc.. *Btw, 'Holy' means w/o sin...their history speaks against them! Romanist? http://www.ewtn.com/faith/teachings/churb3.htm Does anyone actually believe that the persecuted (& 'refined' thru such) Christian church of faith during the 1st 300 yrs, meeting in homes, became a 'better' church after being 'taken over' by the Romans and mixed with their pagan beliefs?! No honest Christian could say 'Yes." The founding principles of the Gospel were watered down with the doctrines of men and thus perverted. And thus came Luther et al & the Reformation, which were primarily based on following the Word of the scriptures and "Ye are saved thru faith by grace and not of your own works." I see the 'true church' as the Body of Christ as who follows the recorded words of Christ, and live a life trusting in faith and not of the works of their own 'filthy-ragged' righteousness."' The 'true' follower of Christ shud be assured of their salvation ("These things have been written that you may 'know' you have eternal life"), and not worrying about 'losing it' every day of their lives. W/o following the Roman Catholic church's doctrines and getting its blessing, they will go to Hell! And so the "True Church" is the Body Of Christ on the earth and follows the 'truth' in the word, not following men, doctrines of men, or an organization that has a history of corruption. The Roman Catholic church became the 'apostate' church, where the 'true believers' came out of her and continued the walk of faith in the Word of God.... Just saying that you are the 'one true church' doesnt make it so in the realm of the Spirit. And looking at the total of those who label themselves as part of the Christian religion (RC Protestants, et al), as Paul spoke about in the 'last days:' 2 Timothy 3 1 But know this, that in the last days grievous times shall come. 2 For men shall be...... 4 ...lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God; 5 holding a form of godliness, but having denied the power therefore. From these also turn away. Which 'to me' reads of false religious groups that are on the earth but are not of 'faith' (which is 'denying the power' of God, for 'w/o faith it is impossible to please God..", ergo, faith is God's 'currency').
YOUR problem...yes...it is YOUR problem. And for all the bad (and please attempt to deny all the burning at the stake the lovely medieval Protestants engaged it), how about recognizing the good the Church has done. Hellloooooo....The Bible would not even be here if it weren't for the Catholic Church. What aren't you understanding? It is the Universal Church. It is One Holy and Apostolic Church. It has different Sees in different areas, --Rome is the Holy See of the Western Church. Hense, the Roman Church. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Catholic_rites_and_churches List of Catholic liturgical rites Alexandrian liturgical tradition; 2 liturgical rites Coptic Rite Ethiopic Rite Antiochian (Antiochene or West-Syrian) liturgical tradition; 3 liturgical rites Maronite Rite (West) Syrian Rite Syro-Malankara Rite Armenian Rite; 1 liturgical rite Armenian Rite Chaldean or East Syrian liturgical tradition; 2 liturgical rites Chaldean Rite Syro-Malabar Rite Byzantine (Constantinopolitan) liturgical tradition; 1 liturgical rite Byzantine Rite Latin (Western) liturgical rites Actively celebrated: Roman Rite, whose historical forms are usually classified as follows Pre-Tridentine Mass (the various pre-1570 forms) Tridentine Mass (1570-1970 and still authorized in circumstances indicated in the document Summorum Pontificum as an extraordinary form of the Roman Rite) Mass of Paul VI (1970–present) Anglican Use (restricted to formerly Anglican congregations) Ambrosian Rite (Milan, Italy and neighbouring areas) Aquileian Rite (defunct: northeastern Italy) Rite of Braga (Braga, Portugal) Mozarabic Rite (Toledo and Salamanca, Spain) Defunct or rarely celebrated: Durham Rite (defunct: Durham, England) Gallican Rite (defunct: Gaul, i.e., France) Celtic Rite (defunct: British Isles) Sarum Rite (defunct: England) Catholic Order Rites (generally defunct) Benedictine Rite Carmelite Rite Carthusian Rite Cistercian Rite Dominican Rite Franciscan Rite Friars Minor Capuchin Rite Premonstratensian Rite Servite Rite Please...just because you were an altar boy at one stage of your life does not mean you know what the hell you are talking about. You read biased (and really OLD) texts that lack peer review and you operate on ignorance. It's really tiresome correcting your brutish nonsense. Wow....You can't even paraphrase the bible correctly. It is "Saved by GRACE through faith"--not the other way around. Except you don't even KNOW the scripture. The rest of your post is parroting Protestant claptrap ....
Broad dismissal, of my own words & studies I might add, doesnt annul the truth in my postings! Fel, Fel, Fel..you're getting really nit picky in your responses such as word reversal, history you dont like, sources you dont like, etc. etc. etc... what's next my spelling..tsk tsk! So,..did you get your ashes today? What are you going to give up for Lent? Suppose to be something that you really like---I gave up Peanut Butter once as a kid, as PB&J were a mainstay of mine--was tough!. Perhaps you shud give up...."Catholic Apologetics?"
LOL There is no defense necessary. A Theocracy is NOT a church, it is a Political Institution which uses theology the same way that a Democracy uses a Constitution. In both cases the government would hang those people from any organization that would rise up, try to form a treason against that Democracy or a Heresy that opposed the theology. People need to recognize that there are only seven kinds of Governemnts, each founded upon a Political Institution that will search out and punish traitors, call them rebels, or accuse them of Treason, identify them as Heretics, or dissidents, whatever. The Law of the Land will always enforce compliance with its Laws.
