Re: In order to feel belittled, one has to care about the person belittling them. People don't have the power to make you feel badly about yourself unless you give it to them. Re: I can't think of a time when women have had as many opportunities as they do today. My nieces are all happily and successfully employed as is my wife. Re: Because my wife is not always patient enough for me to get around to fixing things, hanging curtain rods, painting the porch furniture etc, she's shown amazing aptitude for doing those and other things herself. It's amazing what women can do when their husband's sloth frees them to discover their true potential. Guess who's getting a cordless drill for her birthday?
Funny story. I have a friend who is married. His wife loves to find little projects for him to do. It seemed to always be when he was home from work trying to relax. He told me he never got to just sit down and rest. So he decided he wasn't going to do any more honey do jobs. I'm always a bit of a helper so when I go over to visit I help it's wife with something. Just a little job that didn't bother me to help out. Next thing I know I had beer in my hand there was his wife saying see it was easy and then I felt bad. This happened the next couple of times I visited them and I did say something to my friend hey I'm sorry I don't mean to get you into hot water. And he looks at me dead serious and it says I'm not offended, but you're about to be trapped.
I don't think so. I think toxic masculinity just refers to the male flavor of being an irrational jerk. Being smart, assertive, and capable-of-violence-when-necessary may be traditional attributes of masculinity but aren't toxic masculinity. I think the reason for the choice of words is that when people get carried away with being macho and masculine, it can reach toxic levels. Dose determines toxicity. A lower, more controlled dose is okay and often good.
the why connect it to masculinity? No I don't think it's that at all. I think it's trying to suggest that masculinity is bad and therefore toxic. There is no need to connect the answer to masculinity. That's like connecting being a whore to femininity There isn't any hard line definition to what is or isn't toxic masculinity that means anything I don't like can be toxic masculinity. Some people think that being attracted to women is toxic masculinity. Some people think been talking to women is toxic masculinity. Some people think boys rough housing with one another is toxic masculinity. So in reality all toxic masculinity is, is masculinity Here's another component of it macho is defined as being proud of your masculinity so it's not something you're supposed to be proud of. Drop the toxic masculinity isn't toxic. There's no connection between toxic behaviors and masculinity. This is just about disparaging masculinity.
No. Toxic masculinity: All it really means is masculinity taken too far. True, where the line is may be a matter of opinion. But no, it is not always a general disparagement of all masculinity.
Drop the toxic. Masculinity isn't toxic. What is masculinity taken to far define that and connect it to masculinity please. Connecting toxicity to masculinity absolutely is to disparage masculinity that's the only point that can be in doing that. I'm willing to change my view if you can explain what masculinity taken to far is.
A very good story that confirms the maxim "No good deed goes unpunished". I've been married for 28 years and my wife's grandmother was my 1st Grade teacher. About 20 years ago we decided to buy her grandmother's big, rambling, old farmhouse complete with an old barn, outbuildings, an old windmill, 5 different types of plumbing and an electric panel box that looked like it had been labeled on April Fool's day. Before I started blacksmithing, I bought, renovated, and sold 5 very old houses so I do know something about home repair projects but multiple orthopedic health issues limit what I can do these days. Fortunately, we have good relationships with all the tradesmen who did the work on this place so my wife just deals directly with them. Earlier, however, my mother in law, who is a generous and jovial old bird, wouldn't hesitate to put my dearest and oldest friends to work in our garden, on our wood pile or around the yard but, now, since these same old friends have also developed medical issues, we can safely feed the birds from the back porch without fear of being put to work. It seems like the older you get, the more you appreciate the value of old and loyal friends. Thanks for the story,
Toxic masculinity is a new term. Why use it at all. Years ago no one needed the term, they could define an individual male with an appropriate adjective. There is no need to tag masculinity with toxic.
Those males that today may be called 'toxic' were covered with a basic phrase that most of us already know. It begins with A, and ends with e. It covered a multitude of sins, and therefore is environmentally friendly. Less clutter that way.
I don't know that users of the term mean to say that masculinity itself is categorically toxic. Just like "irrational exuberance."
I can't think of a phrase that starts with an "A" and ends with an "e". Theres a word that comes to mind for someone who is obnoxious and aggressive that is synonymous with "rectum"..... ..... am I getting close? At any rate, the term, "toxic masculinity" is relative new to me that doesn't seem to be very useful. Thanks,
Technically it's two words. So 'word' doesn't cover it, so I used 'phrase'. Are we really going go this route?
Toxic Is now appropriate because it causes damage to others. The balance of expectations about what masculine means has changed. The old understanding is now unacceptable and disrespects women. The term is appropriate to what relationships should be.
Exactly how is masculinity disrespectful to women? Is femineity disrespectful to men? Not every one who is masculine is brutish in nature. Assumptions as such really don't read well. There is absolutely nothing wrong, or inappropriate, in a masculine and feminine relationship. Each person has their preferences, and to say it's what should be in scaled down masculinity, is your opinion, and yours only.
I said TOXIC masculinity is harmful to women. It dehumanises them. If you are going to get into a discussion at least read properly.
Actually, you said: "The old understanding is now unacceptable and disrespects women." The 'old understanding' is masculinity. Adding the word 'toxic' is something new. Clarifying what you said, is not the same as me reading, word for word, what you typed.
The old understanding of masculinity does not include toxic Quote me in entirety please, not out of context. I wrote "The balance of expectations about what masculine means has changed." The old understanding doesnt represent what women see as masculine. In fact some of the old assumptions are now considered toxic.. Don't cut and paste my paragraphs please.
I was, in specific, responding to that statement. Separate sentence, separate line. You want continuity, then you need to post it in continuity. Your opinion, not general consensus. Some of the 'old' assumptions may be considered toxic by SOME people. Not everyone sees things the way you do, so the interpretation is not the same. I would be curious, however, to know what in the old 'masculinity' (outside of the abusive person) is considered 'toxic'? Holding a door open? Pulling out one's chair? Referring to a woman as 'my wife'? Being protective of family?
Treating women with disrespect, assuming they are not as capable of thinking as men, controlling their activities, leaving all childrearing to them, excluding them from family finances, not letting them get on with their own careers, dissing them "as a standard joke" and assuming they will be mens housemaids. And thinking this woman doesn't know how to construct consecutive sentences that you think are OK to dissect and change their meaning. This woman isn't as stupid as you may assume women are. And todays' women are clued into men who treat them as the second gender. Men don't get kudos for opening doors for women unless they are the doors of equal opportunity.
I don't care what your gender is. My discussion point has nothing to do with your gender, nor does it buy you a pass on the subject. You had each sentence on a separate line, and in grammar, that means a separate thought. I don't 'diss' women at all, I discuss SUBJECTS. Unless you are saying that is what you feel 'toxic masculinity' is? I see the same from women towards men at times, and I don't call it toxic. Actions as such are by self centered PEOPLE, who think they are just special. Expectations that the man is going to take the garbage out, service the car, bury the household pets if need be, defend house and home, be the wage earner, and romance the woman. See, it goes both ways. Is that 'toxic femininity'? Women aren't stupid, far from it. Men aren't stupid, far from it. Individuals can be stupid at times. Leave your paintbrush at home. Your defensiveness is excessive and isn't relevant. Discuss the subject, or don't bother replying.
You say you dint care about gender and then use the rest of your post to garbled about it? The thread is about toxic MASCULINITY...à gender issue. Nor have you discussed the subject, just some stereotype of gender expectations. I think you have nothing left of and value to add. Case closed.
PEOPLE (both men and women) that CHOOSE TO BE VICTIMS BECOME VICTIMS. PEOPLE THAT CHOOSE TO BE SUCCESSFUL ACHIEVERS BECOME SUCCESSFUL ACHIEVERS.
"Toxic masculinity" is another aberration of language. What is truly happening is "ignorant human interchange", something common to both genders and all races, cultures and times. What is genuinely toxic in society is all the lies we inculcate.
I have indeed discussed the subject, you apparently don't have answers. The TOPIC is about 'toxic masculinity', yet you felt it necessary to discuss YOUR gender, which, according to you, is not the gender that's being discussed. I don't care what YOUR gender is. I guess you missed that part? If there is 'toxic masculinity', based on the misogynic statements and actions of some, there is also 'toxic femineity' based on the same thought and actions. To use a paintbrush to describe such actions by either gender, once again takes the few and exaggerates the overall impact.
